03:34:29 Experimental (bcrawl) branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-5261-gd9800d219b 05:05:05 mechanic where you sit and watch the waves and new items can wash up. To enforce the RP aspect of it you have to wait real-life time for each new item. 07:41:50 New branch created: pull/5366 (2 commits) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5366 07:41:51 03Brian Power02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5366 * 0.35-a0-841-gce8e19a090: i18n: Translate HUD captions 10(2 hours ago, 13 files, 386+ 26-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/ce8e19a090c2 07:41:51 03Brian Power02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5366 * 0.35-a0-842-gfeb9eb36d5: i18n: When silenced, erase the noise bar in a way that doesn't depend on the length of the string "Silenced" 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 5+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/feb9eb36d57c 08:07:29 03Brian Power02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5366 * 0.35-a0-843-g76dec8c0ac: i18n: Add new source files to MSVC project 10(49 seconds ago, 2 files, 8+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/76dec8c0ac2d 08:16:04 03Brian Power02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5366 * 0.35-a0-844-g5ca113504b: i18n: Add new source file to Android project 10(59 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5ca113504b3b 12:56:50 [stable 0.34 bug?] clarity doesn't prevent obsidian axe's Mesm effect 13:06:08 clarity obtained from Co gizmo, if relevant 13:33:43 <04dracoomega> ssm_: That is intentional. (In 0.35, the description was updated to be more explicit about that) 14:09:08 thought I recalled that obsidian axe is immune to clarity 14:32:28 Should the Hellfire Mortar message refer to a "deafening crack" without checking how loud it actually was? 14:33:04 <09hellmonk> maybe it should get big noise 14:38:19 <04dracoomega> It is loud 14:38:44 <04dracoomega> 20 noise, in fact 14:40:36 It is by default, but it could be a lot quieter than that with Dithmenos and the cloak of the Thief. I don't know if there's a way to cast it when silenced. 14:40:40 <04dracoomega> (If you're referring to it not necessarily being so loud if you, I dunno, worship Dith and wear a Cloak of the Thief, I feel like trying to adjust our sound-related messages for those situations is a path to madness.) 14:40:56 <04dracoomega> Like, there are a lot of messages in the game that imply volume of noise 14:41:02 <04dracoomega> Including various things monsters do 14:41:55 Arguably it's one of those cute attention to detail things that people tend to enjoy 14:42:13 Unless they're trying to match against it in their config for whatever reason... 14:46:52 Are there many places where an in-game message suggests the player makes a loud noise without regard to the facts? 14:47:24 <02Darby> on top of there being so many messages that would need to be modified in this way, it could also become awkward with learning, for example, dampened shouts 14:48:03 <02Darby> e.g. a monster that roars deafeningly would need a different message even though they're making the same roar as ever, you're just suppressing noise 14:48:09 <04dracoomega> Aliscans: Literally nowhere checks Dith/Thief for messaging purposes 14:48:39 <04dracoomega> (There are checks in various places for whether a noise is silenced entirely, but nothing to suggest the noise is quieter than it would normally be) 14:48:58 There isn't much which asserts that the player makes a noise, though. 14:49:17 <04dracoomega> I mean, Dith quiets every other noise, too (as long as it's in LoS) 14:49:23 Crawl generally leaves that to the noise bar. 14:49:24 <04dracoomega> Player-generated noises aren't special 14:50:04 They're things the player can control. If the player is being told false information, it makes that harder. 14:50:15 <04dracoomega> So if you were trying to write text descriptions for player actions being quieter, I feel the same treatment would be needed for any noises that monsters can make (which includes a number of things are that in plaintext in monspeak.txt) 14:51:08 I don't know. As I said, there aren't many places where the game messages comment on how loud a player's actions are. 14:51:11 <04dracoomega> (I would argue that writing player actions as if they have become quiet, but monster actions as if they have not is more false information that present) 14:51:25 <04dracoomega> Since it's actually pretty important that you muffle monster shouts, too 14:51:27 <04dracoomega> Mechanically 14:51:54 Perhaps, but see my last comment. 14:52:43 No-one would notice because the game rarely says anything. It's just the odd message like the hellfire mortar one which stick out like a sore thumb. 14:53:05 <04dracoomega> Again: why are these more significant than monster messages saying they did something loudly? 14:53:12 <04dracoomega> In terms of being misleading 14:53:12 (FWIW I was just thinking of cases where the noise is made while the $thing is fully silenced) 14:53:30 Again, the player can control the player's actions.# 14:54:21 <02Darby> I think the most important point you've made is: Crawl generally leaves that to the noise bar. 14:54:24 <04dracoomega> It's unclear to my how this is actually relevant here. 14:54:52 <04dracoomega> To suggest it's having an effect only on your actions, but not other monster's actions, just seems more false 14:55:01 <04dracoomega> (And yes, the noise bar is still there) 14:55:04 Darby: What I think would help would be if the word "deafening" was deleted from that message. 14:55:38 <04dracoomega> For that matter, there's a reasonable argument that it's only muffling the noise that's reaching other creatures, since the player never has a harder time hearing anything clearly from any distance. I doubt Dith is making you deaf. 14:58:35 If you are misled into believing that a spell is louder than it actually is, you may be unduly reluctant to use it. 14:59:21 I think even using the word "deafening" for a spell which is merely "extremely loud" risks that to a degree. 15:00:21 <04dracoomega> Hey, dragon roars are also 'deafening' and quiet a bit quieter 15:00:42 I will say that as a player my expectations there would be guided more by the noise bar than anything else (though I also am /very/ good at ignoring the messages buffer much to my detriment) 15:00:42 <04dracoomega> (12 vs. 20) 15:00:52 <02Darby> (I also imagine that reminding the player of the loud noise of a summon, rather than a conjuration, is part of the point) 15:01:08 <11Odds> Huh, never really thought about how dith doesn’t really make much sense 15:01:08 <04dracoomega> 20 is like... in the top 5 loudest spells or something 15:01:19 <04dracoomega> ...in what way? 15:01:43 <11Odds> The way I can still hear stuff just fine 15:02:09 <04dracoomega> I mean, I think of it more as supernatural 'stealth' if anything. Your senses aren't impaired, but those of monsters around you are. 15:02:21 <04dracoomega> Gods are powerful 15:02:51 <11Odds> Yeah…. not so much it doesn’t make sense as my particular way of thinking about it didn’t make sense 15:03:35 <04dracoomega> Yes, hellfire mortar is explicitly unusually noise for a spell like that 15:04:22 <02Darby> it's sort of notable how most ally creation spells that are loud (dcall and gateway) include it in the message since that's not the default, while conjurations assume you are looking at the noise bar since of course they're loud 15:04:51 perryprog: The thing about the noise bar is that it only reflects your last action. Messages stay around for a bit longer. 15:05:21 I suppose, but my instinct as a player would still be to rely on the noise bar over any messages 15:10:36 Just trying to work out, with Dragon's Call, do the messages ever say how loud anything is? 15:13:25 <04dracoomega> I mean, it says that the dragon horde roars back! when you cast it. (And of course the spell description itself says that it's loud) 15:14:34 <02Darby> referring to You call out to the draconic realm, and the dragon horde roars back!, the resounding crunch of summon forest, and the horrible noise of malign gateway as all indicators to pay attention to the noise bar as summoners might otherwise ignore 15:15:25 <02Darby> hellfire mortar's deafening crack is consistent with the tradition of "check the noise bar" messages on loud non-conjurations 15:15:57 noise bar is also where you check-in at for a silent disco 15:20:04 <04dracoomega> Now, one thing that maybe could be a good idea is having the listed noise value in your spell list actually factor in Dith/thief. (It's unclear to me whether this is more helpful or confusing, though. To show the 'real' noise it will generate versus the 'normal' noise it would generate.) 15:28:27 Darby: It's consistent it having a message, but inconsistent in that it says there's a loud noise when the other spells just say that there's a noise. 15:37:40 <11Odds> Tend to think it would be less useful… it would collapse the bands to the quiet end and so give less information 15:37:56 <04dracoomega> That is a fair point, yeah 15:38:15 <11Odds> And you quickly get a sense for what “loud with dith” means 17:44:56 <09gammafunk> Someone just mentioned this bug in trunk: > You encounter an orc warrior. It is wielding a +0 war axe and wearing a +1 barding of flying. 17:45:10 <09gammafunk> known problem? 17:46:24 A question about spelling in Crawl code: I know that the strings presented to the user should use British/Australian spellings rather than American ones, but what about the naming of functions, etc. Should that also use British spelling? For example, in my PR, I created source files called localise.h/.cc and a functional called localise(). Should 17:46:24 it be localize instead? 17:46:37 *function 17:53:56 Speaking only for myself, I suggest sticking to AUSENG 17:57:47 <04dracoomega> Huh. There is code that's supposed to prevent this. ....oh dear, the logic is backwards 17:58:13 <04dracoomega> (So everyone can pick up and put on bardings except centaurs and naga andn the like) 17:58:18 <09gammafunk> nice 17:58:19 oops 17:58:39 <09gammafunk> boolean logic was a mistake! 17:58:40 <04dracoomega> (I think I reversed the semantics of the method partway through writing it and never changed that part) 17:58:51 <04dracoomega> Easy fix, at least 17:59:29 <04dracoomega> Unlike other things I've been working on lately >.> 18:00:08 <09gammafunk> @dracoomega you may have seen this already, but if you do push a fix, please resolve https://github.com/crawl/crawl/issues/5367 18:00:17 <04dracoomega> Sure 18:00:37 <04dracoomega> (I will fix it in a bit) 18:06:19 "I think I reversed the semantics of the method partway through writing it" very relatable mistake 19:06:22 03Brian Power02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5366 * 0.35-a0-845-g0e5a8f8016: i18n: Align template and German version of ui.txt 10(62 seconds ago, 2 files, 3+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0e5a8f801616 19:18:09 03Brian Power02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5366 * 0.35-a0-846-gdc916b910b: i18n: Don't initialise the translate db if current language is English 10(66 seconds ago, 1 file, 6+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/dc916b910bf1 23:45:16 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.35-a0-840-g1b83f8deab