03:34:36 Experimental (bcrawl) branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-5261-gd9800d219b 03:52:35 03CrawlOdds02 07* 0.35-a0-450-gd42afd07ce: Prevent evasion of divine bans on forms 10(20 hours ago, 10 files, 34+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/d42afd07ce33 03:53:01 <11Odds> ^ Good bug this one, liches of TSO are quite strong. It doesn't appear anyone used this. 04:01:51 <04dracoomega> Cute bug. I didn't make undead state a form field at the time since so few forms make use of it (and I don't really see us adding more that do). Of course, it's fine that it is (but I would personally prefer if the formatting of it in the yaml was consistent with how other enum stuff around it is specified or other people reading the file might assume that the difference in formatting is required.) 04:02:12 <04dracoomega> Y'know, in some theoretical future 04:04:19 <11Odds> Ah yeah that's fair on the formatting, will make it so. I thought that when I found myself needing a "form_undeadness" functon I should just put in on the form. 04:05:05 <04dracoomega> That is fair 04:05:52 <11Odds> (I think I'd also argue that the lack of it did lead to the small bug of failing to check vampire form!) 04:07:40 <04dracoomega> Very possible, yes 04:08:32 03CrawlOdds02 07* 0.35-a0-451-g0f6935aab5: Make formatting of form YAML fields more consistent 10(83 seconds ago, 3 files, 3+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0f6935aab542 05:18:17 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.35-a0-451-g0f6935a (34) 09:24:45 03CrawlOdds02 07* 0.35-a0-452-gb6d0317de6: Fix undeadness of undead species. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b6d0317de6df 09:28:25 <11Odds> Oh dear, sorry about that one. IDK if we do extra rollouts to fix bugs in some way? 11:46:14 <09gammafunk> yes, we can rebuild on a bunch of servers, but some require pinging; you want to check which versions are installed first 11:46:17 <09gammafunk> &versions 11:46:22 <04Cerebot> Latest versions seen in milestones this week: [LLD] => 0.34.1-3-ga2c7840, [CBR2 CDO CUE CXC CRG CBRG] => 0.35-a0-449-g293c6a0, [CAO] => 0.35-a0-451-g0f6935a, [CDI CNC CPO] => 0.35-a0-452-gb6d0317 11:46:25 <09gammafunk> so CDI will rebuild in 15 minutes anyhow 11:47:24 <09gammafunk> @Odds what's the version that introduced the bug. Just as a helpful thing for future commit messages, if you fix a bug introduced in a previous commit, it's always nice to include the hash of the commit that introduced the bug in your bugfix commit message 11:49:11 <11Odds> Will do - it was 0.35-a0-450-gd42afd07ce; CAO is the only server that build with it 13:27:18 <04dracoomega> Whoopsie. (I didn't notice on glancing over the code, either, for what it's worth ^^; ) 14:18:05 <09gammafunk> perfect, let me DGL admin you on CAO, since I can do that, and let you trigger the rebuild so you can become familiar with our amazing, high-tech, state-of-the-art, don't-tell-google-because-if-you-do-they'll-buy-out-DCSS-immediately rebuild process 14:22:52 <09gammafunk> ok, done, can you confirm now that when you log into the CAO lobby here under your Odds account that you have a "Toggle admin panel" link? Doing so should show you a button to send a player announcement to chats of all active players and see some basic server stats. You don't need to do anything with those, just confirm that you're a DGL admin 14:23:15 <09gammafunk> it should show up above the game links but below the welcome message at the top 14:23:35 <11Odds> Yep 14:23:38 <09gammafunk> ok 14:23:40 <09gammafunk> ??rebuild[2 14:23:40 <04Cerebot> rebuild[2/2]: Trunk update start times in UTC (second number during summer time): CAO: 1700; CDO: 0600/0500; CUE: 2300/2200; CXC: 0600; CPO: every 15 minutes; CDI: trunk and experimentals every 15 minutes, others 0800/0700. 14:23:43 <09gammafunk> ??rebuild 14:23:44 <04Cerebot> rebuild[1/2]: Devs can trigger rebuilds for these servers: https://crawl.akrasiac.org/rebuild https://cbro.berotato.org/rebuild https://crawl.dcss.io/rebuild https://archive.nemelex.cards/rebuild Bug gammafunk, advil, or Nap.Kin for CDO. Use your powers wisely. 14:24:06 <09gammafunk> click that first link for CAO and it will ask you for our Odds account auth, enter it and you should see the rebuild page 14:24:30 <09gammafunk> (you can save the password in your browser like you would for a normal dialog, it's an old-school HTTP auth password) 14:24:59 <11Odds> Nice, and I think I can navigate the complexities of the rebuild page 🙂 14:25:19 <09gammafunk> you should get "Select a version", where you can hit submit for Trunk. Do so and keep the page open until the rebuild completes. If you close it before it finishes, the build will not complete as it's a server-side CGI 14:25:49 <09gammafunk> likewise it sometimes just fails to complete since your browser might timeout the request as it's feeding script output continuously 14:25:53 <11Odds> There are a lot more build warnings than I'm used to 14:26:14 <09gammafunk> in that case you can generally resubmit the rebuild and it will resume, although you might need to wait a bit for the lock to clear 14:26:45 <09gammafunk> yes, it's simple, but I want to give you the list of "gotchas" so you know what to expect, like I said this is old school tech 14:27:07 <09gammafunk> yeah CAO is running an ancient OS with a very old gcc 14:27:18 <09gammafunk> although there are currently some warning coming from gcc for trunk these days 14:27:25 <09gammafunk> often there are and they go unfixed for a while 14:27:36 <09gammafunk> some people use clang and don't see the gcc warnings etc 14:27:57 <04dracoomega> Yeah, I noticed one that I meant to get to taking a look at at some point (but have been buried in glyphs >.>) 14:28:25 <09gammafunk> glad you've finally come over to console playing! welcome to the elite 5% DO! 14:30:04 <04dracoomega> 5% is a funny way of saying 2%, imo 14:30:26 <11Odds> BTW DO let me know if you'd like me to look at that Oka throwing thing (which mostly means getting some numbers on how big the effect is). I have some crawl dev time on my hands and not many plans for it! 14:30:36 <04dracoomega> (I do think I will finally have the Great Unicode Monster Reorganization ready to push today, though) 14:31:16 <09gammafunk> !lg * recent s=tiles% 14:31:22 <04Cerebot> 2095322 games for * (recent): 2057404x true (98.19%), 37922x false (1.81%) 14:31:27 <09gammafunk> hrm 14:31:48 <09gammafunk> !lg * recent x=cdist(name) s=tiles 14:32:12 <09gammafunk> I'm sure there's a means of account where I can inflate this number 14:32:15 <04Cerebot> 2095327 games for * (recent): 2057405x true [29148], 37922x false [567] 14:32:26 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.35-a0-452-gb6d0317de6 (34) 14:32:44 <09gammafunk> !calc 567.0 / (29148+567) 14:32:47 <04Cerebot> 0.02 14:32:50 <09gammafunk> welp 14:33:11 <09gammafunk> it just means console players are even more elite 14:33:37 <11Odds> !lg * recent s=tiles / won 14:33:49 <04Cerebot> 18489/2095332 games for * (recent): 17616/2057410x true [0.86%], 873/37922x false [2.30%] 14:34:36 <04dracoomega> Feel free! I'm not likely to get to it for a little while, at least. (I had honestly been mulling over other changes to Oka throwing gifts in past, like maybe replacing them entirely with an expensive 'Pray for Ammunition' ability that gives you an ammo acquirement, allowing you a little more control over your options and making ammo trade off with other abilities somewhat. But for that to be compelling, throwing itself would need 14:34:36 to be more diverse, so most of my ideas for reevaluating rate/method kind of hinge on actually doing a major pass on throwing itself, which sure isn't happening in the immediate future.) 15:05:05 <09hellmonk> If you have design goals for throwing rework I don't mind taking it on 15:10:14 dartboard: ability to mulch artifacts into ammo (anything other than artifacts would be tedious and bad, see selling to shops) | throwing enemies | throwing up (spit poison) | throw your arm for 1 unarmed attack but you get missing arm mutation forever 15:28:53 you get missing arm but it becomes an ally (cousin itt 😛 ) 15:32:01 <04dracoomega> The plans were still nebulous enough that it's hard to be too specific about anything, but I'd say general goals involve more throwable types/brands and especially more interesting ones (rather than The World's Most Vanilla Projectile). Index mulled over the idea of doing something a little like wand item sets with regard to throwable types per-seed. Consumable inventory does give us more freedom to have somewhat more 15:32:02 throwables than now, but interface issues mean we probably don't want super many at once. Probably want to change throwable scaling somehow. Make the stealth-scaling needles into a different item type to make their mechanical distinction from poison/curare more obvious ('kunai' was proposed). There was talk of making mulching work using an internal 'durability' system (hidden from the player) so that it wasn't possible to lose all of your starting 15:32:02 throwables the first time you use them (which feels real bad). Generally reduce how many instances of a given throwable the player has at once, while making them more consistently durable (as part of an attempt to further differentiate from wands by making your per fight shots much lower, but potentially being able to reuse those for longer.) I think one general issue with a bunch of this is that evocables potentially cover a lot of design space 15:32:03 that a more compelling throwing system would occupy. Wands are already an 'ammo-based' consumable that you typically use as a secondary boost to whatever else you're doing, and their flavor allows a much wider range of design space than throwables do. And I've already wanted to make a bunch more evokers, for a long time now. So a question I've had is "How does a more interesting throwing system feel compellingly distinct from evocations?" and I've 15:32:03 certainly not fully settled on an answer to this that I'm satisfied with. 15:32:21 throwable 3x3 bomb as a replacement for the missing silver boomerang sounds fun for small species 15:32:33 maybe it detonates in 2-3 turns or something 15:32:39 big noise 15:33:30 forgecraft is a thing so it's not off theme 15:33:34 <09hellmonk> how would you do internal hidden durability in a way that prevents me from just manually tracking it 15:33:43 <09hellmonk> (the rest sounds reasonable to me) 15:36:31 <04dracoomega> I assumed it would be fuzzed a fair bit 15:37:04 <04dracoomega> But still result in being able to have a single javelin that would have 0 chance of breaking until you'd at least used it a few times 15:37:36 <04dracoomega> (I think the durability would be 'per type' incidentally, rather than ever caring about the status of a specific javelin) 15:37:45 <04dracoomega> So that there isn't weird stacking behavior 15:38:39 <04dracoomega> Like, even with heavily fuzzed durability, I guess there's still a point where like "Will never break in less than X throws" that you could technically count, but I'm not sure if doing so actually has meaningful advantages to the player? 15:39:30 <04dracoomega> (I also felt like durability should probably only be consumed if it actually hits something instead of also losing them just as often on misses) 15:39:47 <04dracoomega> And the current 'mulch bonus' can just go away 15:40:58 <04dracoomega> (Possibly along with the current behavior where javelins breaking mid-throw stop penetrating) 15:41:50 <09hellmonk> ah, so doing it as a player prop for each ammo type or something 15:42:07 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.35-a0-452-gb6d0317de6 (34) 15:43:13 <09hellmonk> I think that would work if the mulch bonus stuff is removed 15:47:32 <04dracoomega> Yeah, it feels unnecessary to me. The main goal of that (as I understand) was to make bad rolls feel a little less unlucky, but we can instead make the really bad rolls just not happen. 18:34:31 New branch created: pull/5285 (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5285 18:34:31 03TrevorShelton02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/5285 * 0.35-a0-453-gba3b2b3d51: Addressed issue #3474 by generalizing weapon encumbrance descriptions. 10(48 minutes ago, 1 file, 44+ 26-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/ba3b2b3d51dc 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-453-ge3e8fbd856: Allow specifying monster base glyphs in unicode 10(2 days ago, 9 files, 29+ 20-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e3e8fbd85613 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-454-gd24a0bbefe: Allow mon_glyph option to accept elemental colors 10(2 days ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/d24a0bbefe79 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-455-g00c4fc7578: Slightly improve monster::foot_name() and hand_name() 10(24 hours ago, 5 files, 23+ 11-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/00c4fc757831 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-456-g10c3989740: Split and rearrange many monster glyphs to make use of unicode 10(4 hours ago, 166 files, 231+ 179-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/10c398974019 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-457-gb837255a24: Change glyphs used for expiring clouds in console 10(4 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b837255a2476 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-458-g9cf51ca6dd: Make merged slime creatures use a gradiant of colors in console 10(3 hours ago, 1 file, 9+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9cf51ca6dd20 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-459-g3fdcecf7f8: Recolour derived undead based on HD instead of size 10(3 hours ago, 1 file, 4+ 4-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/3fdcecf7f8db 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-460-gb6d9887bba: Recolour living spells based on their spell in console 10(3 hours ago, 3 files, 14+ 4-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b6d9887bbac9 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-461-g37cfcd692e: Fix some living spells not being named properly 10(3 hours ago, 1 file, 6+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/37cfcd692e9a 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-462-g85f9a3a65e: Allow using the mon_glyph to remap Bai Suzhen's dragon form and SoH 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 14+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/85f9a3a65e09 19:00:06 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.35-a0-463-gb6da721869: Make screaming refractions nonliving horrors 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b6da721869ff 19:36:15 <08nicolae> we've no doubt ruined backwards compatibility for ones, possibly even twos of users 20:16:58 <09gammafunk> you just reminded me of those backward compatibility glyph files we used to make 20:17:10 <09gammafunk> I forget if we just outright removed them, but they definitely haven't been updated in years 20:18:42 <09hellmonk> backward compatibility is a fool's errand. You can't step in the same ~ twice. 20:21:28 they're still referenced in options_guide, I think? 20:21:33 mentioned at least 20:21:49 and yes, I immediately thought of that as well 20:30:02 looks like most of them are gone, but we still have dec_glyphs, ibm_glyphs, and old_unicode_glyphs 20:47:52 oh, looks like the old files did finally get removed from options_guide 22:35:59 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.35-a0-463-gb6da721869 (34) 22:59:47 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.35-a0-463-gb6da721869 23:33:52 Unstable branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.35-a0-463-gb6da721869 (34) 23:56:17 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.35-a0-463-gb6da721869