00:59:25 -!- indigaz20 is now known as indigaz2 02:55:45 <06mumra> I'm wondering what is the planned change to god gifting, specifically for Sif? I had this idea to change how the gifts happen but I'm not sure about the gift timer itself. I don't think my idea works as is but I thought the theme was really cool so I'll put it out there if anyone can do anything with it. Basically instead of just getting a book dropped at your feet, you get the message "Sif Muna invites you to her library". Now you 02:55:45 get an active ability which can be used any time and transports you instantly to a special library portal rather like Oka's arena. Friendly tomes are wandering around and so on. In the library time is frozen so no HP/MP regen, but you can use consumables, switch armour, adjust spells, shapeshift. A choice of 3 books are laid out in front of you, taking one of them makes the other two despawn. Time in the dungeon is frozen so everything will be exactly 02:55:45 as it was when you return. Why I don't really think it works is (aside from considerations of whether it's just too powerful) is I don't think the choice between taking a book gift while you're safe, or waiting until you're actually in some danger when you might want to use it, is particularly a good one. But the idea of being able to pick up a new spell mid-combat and immediately learn it, and come back out blasting things with it, seems really 02:55:45 interesting. 03:03:41 <04dracoomega> While this is really cool flavor, I fear it may be a little convoluted for what basically boils down to 'Pick 1 of 3 books', considering the player would also be expected to do this many, many times over the course of an entire run (and most of the time, none of the results are going to matter much to them.) (Really, I'd mostly assumed some pretty low-key changes to Sif's gifting, like making the gift timeout no longer directly eat 03:03:42 away at piety, and just rebalancing piety gain to whatever rate feels appropriate overall. Them being entangled has repeatedly had some awkwardnesses that are most visible with Sif, like making it very hard to reach 6* piety) 03:06:23 <04dracoomega> Also: 'pull out a new spell mid-combat' is, to some degree, also what Exegesis is allowing one to do 03:06:43 <04dracoomega> Yes, it needs to be in your library already, but in the sense of "Picking the tool you need right now from a much larger list than the spells you can ordinarily use." 03:07:01 <04dracoomega> (The proposed Exegesis changes will likely also help with that list of viable choices being larger) 03:07:27 <06mumra> Perhaps it would be a rarer thing (to offset the potential tactical utility), and you just get multiple books at once. But yeah, as someone noted in Roguelikes just now, the active abilities eating into the gift timer is the big problem, and one I felt on my playthrough every time I used an ability. 03:09:14 <06mumra> As I said, I didn't feel the idea was viable, I just thought the flavour was cool 03:12:16 <04dracoomega> Yeah, the flavor is cool 03:12:49 <04dracoomega> I'd actually think it might be neat and workable if Sif had a much more limited number of gifts, but 'will eventually give you every single spell' still feels like a valueable aspect of them 03:32:36 Experimental (bcrawl) branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-5261-gd9800d219b 06:14:02 <08nicolae> sif's tremendous tomes 07:09:42 <09gammafunk> I'm not sure how you can reconcile wanting sif to gift every spell (many people are fond of this) with a smallish number of gifts 07:10:01 <09gammafunk> gifting enormous numbers of spells at once isn't something we'd want 07:11:54 <09gammafunk> feels like sif doesn't need a big influx of complexity for reasons of theme or tweaking the gift system. Obviously the tweaks to exegesis and removal of gift timeout (and possibly removal of piety decay at some point in general) will address the biggest concern about gifts 07:18:38 <08nicolae> divine exegesis lets you cast from sif's library of all the spells in the game, not just your own library, so you can still cast any spell you want 07:26:54 <04dracoomega> I mean, I agree. I was just saying, essentially "If we didn't care about Sif gifting everything, it might be okay to do condensed gifting, but we probably do, so it isn't" 07:28:00 <04dracoomega> One might be able to justify that on flavor grounds, but I think that plays a lot less interestingly if every run is going to have the same library of options from the start. 07:43:07 <04dracoomega> ...I have just learned that a player naga having any monster anywhere constricted by roots or BVC will prevent them from being able to constrict with their melee attack. As far as I can tell, this has literally been true for as long as ranged constriction has existed. 07:43:37 <04dracoomega> (Octopodes also consider those targets to be occupying tentacles, but it's a lot more implausible to root 8 monsters at once than it is 1) 07:48:29 <04dracoomega> Okay, I guess a few less than 8 when accounting for weapons and shields and such. (I hadn't realized that they directly cut down how many things you can constrict by so much. I guess it doesn't come up a lot.) 07:57:09 <04dracoomega> Fixing this isn't altogether straightforward with how the code is presently structured, unfortunately 08:02:06 <04dracoomega> Actually, this might be true for monsters, too, and is just vastly less likely to matter 08:03:05 <04dracoomega> Yeah, if a monster naga zaps something with a wand of roots, they also lose their constricting melee at the same time 08:03:30 <04dracoomega> (It's just that it's most likely that it's just you targeting you in either case, so it doesn't matter) 09:11:22 <08nicolae> can you keep monster nagas from constricting you by constricting something else with BVC or roots 09:29:14 <09hellmonk> fr: change the description of the silence spell from "greatly hamper stealth" to "slightly reduce stealth" 09:39:03 constriction> wow, what a corker of a bug 09:53:10 <09gammafunk> @icoson Apparently all systems with python 3.13 or newer need to do to run webtiles is install the crypt-r module, which is a copy of the deprecated crypt module formerly in the stdlib. Since this appears to be standard practice for retired modules, I guess we don't have to do anything immediate in terms of porting webtiles/dgamelaunch to a modern algorithm (and upgrading databases). If it sounds good to you, I'll just update our 09:53:11 instructions to list crypt-r as a required module for python 3.13 and later. I'm not sure how much we care about updating code to use non-ancient cryptography. Updating dgamelaunch to use said crypto might not be that bad, but we'd also need to make a python tool to port databases...if that's even possible (since we don't have the actual user passwords to re-encrypt)? 09:55:48 03Implojin02 07* 0.34-a0-954-g59ef0daa6d: Remove Silence's stealth penalty (rypofalem, hellmonk) 10(4 minutes ago, 4 files, 3+ 14-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/59ef0daa6df7 09:55:49 <03implojin> I'd try to hint that rypo could do a commit ramoving that before, but I guess rypo didn't want to do a balance change (small as it might have been) 09:55:59 <06pleasingfungus> nooo my carefully tuned game balance noooooooo 09:56:11 <06pleasingfungus> catastrophe...................................................................... .. . 09:56:16 <09gammafunk> !silence PleasingFungus 09:56:17 <04Cerebot> gammafunk gestures wildly while chanting. A profound silence engulfs PleasingFungus. 09:57:10 <06pleasingfungus> 10:30:54 03Implojin02 07* 0.34-a0-955-g26e05f8c72: Fix Marionette targeter infoleaking illusions (radio-gra) 10(52 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/26e05f8c72f5 11:01:47 <08nicolae> !silence cerebot 11:01:48 <04Cerebot> nicolae casts a spell. A profound silence engulfs cerebot. 11:01:56 <08nicolae> ha! eat shit nerd 12:06:13 <02tzer0> Morgue is back up on CUE, crawlmorgue:fuckaibros is the authentication required. 12:12:55 <02Darby> you truly are always learning such cursed truths 13:01:09 <04dracoomega> So cursed that I am probably refactoring constriction code again, in fact >.>; 13:01:29 <04dracoomega> (Not just on account of that, but that's part of it) 13:19:55 -!- adelrune_ is now known as adelrune 14:12:12 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.34-a0-956-g0af764086a: Don't trigger Trickster against firewood (Sergey) 10(71 seconds ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0af764086a97 15:40:00 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.34-a0-956-g0af764086a (34) 22:35:34 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.34-a0-956-g0af764086a (34) 22:58:53 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.34-a0-956-g0af764086a 23:13:37 Unstable branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.34-a0-956-g0af764086a (34) 23:55:43 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.34-a0-956-g0af764086a