00:22:28 <04Cgettys> RE: Uskayaw's dance boots 00:22:48 <04Cgettys> I ruled it out before, but what about ensnare instead of para chance? 00:22:52 <04Cgettys> would require some flavoring 00:23:38 <04Cgettys> "You trip X and they get caught on something"? 00:23:39 <04Cgettys> idk 00:39:04 New branch created: pull/4411 (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4411 00:39:04 03tianmaster02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4411 * 0.33-a0-1142-ge8385dc753: feat: Add staff of earth's ac bonus and update description 10(14 minutes ago, 4 files, 20+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e8385dc75381 00:55:45 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1141-g12c12526e9 01:04:26 03tianmaster02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4411 * 0.33-a0-1143-g936f687084: check white 10(43 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/936f6870844d 03:29:14 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-gb12684bf0b: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1166+ 464-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b12684bf0bf0 03:37:42 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-g60c6f295a2: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1148+ 464-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/60c6f295a283 04:10:27 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-ga3d0f9db51: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1171+ 472-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a3d0f9db51bf 04:16:48 03nlavsky02 07* 0.33-a0-1142-g846544658f: fix: display the vexed status icon in webtiles 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/846544658f84 04:22:05 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-ged23a4b05d: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1171+ 472-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/ed23a4b05deb 04:32:52 Experimental (bcrawl) branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-5261-gd9800d219b 05:00:06 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-g51c9e1ea56: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1194+ 469-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/51c9e1ea5671 05:07:25 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1142-g8465446 (34) 05:08:32 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-g75aac5a3bb: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1194+ 469-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/75aac5a3bbe3 07:11:11 03cadi02 {GitHub} 07* 0.33-a0-1143-ga82abb8be2: [webTile] : add expiring description for expiring status (#4110) 10(53 seconds ago, 1 file, 8+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a82abb8be2e4 07:21:46 03hellmonk02 07* 0.33-a0-1144-g30fa6646ce: Don't persist bind soul through stairs (kleiner-fisch). 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/30fa6646ce2d 07:21:46 03hellmonk02 07* 0.33-a0-1145-g780a91e42c: update credits 10(84 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/780a91e42cdf 07:21:46 03hellmonk02 07* 0.33-a0-1146-g41a24375dd: checkwhite 10(63 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/41a24375dd56 07:23:53 03dolorous02 07* 0.33-a0-1147-g86ab01573d: Unbrace. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/86ab01573dce 07:27:04 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-g3bd6bca67e: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1207+ 468-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/3bd6bca67e21 07:33:25 <09hellmonk> would like opinions on #3832 07:35:02 <09hellmonk> I think we could just pass a random arg to stat_modify damage like we do for spell damage dice but the intent seems good 07:36:19 <09hellmonk> unsure if this is easier or better than mumra's solution 07:37:39 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-ga299deaa4c: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1207+ 468-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a299deaa4ce9 07:38:43 03WizardIke02 {GitHub} 07* 0.33-a0-1148-gb62e7e9324: Fix the mouse doing incorrect commands when keys are rebound (#4282) 10(4 seconds ago, 7 files, 40+ 16-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b62e7e932431 07:42:49 <04dracoomega> This is one of those things that looks simple at first glance, but which I might want to actually reflect on a bit 07:43:14 <04dracoomega> When my brain is less full of other things >.> 07:48:19 04Build failed for 08master @ a82abb8b 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/14130833914 07:48:20 04Build failed for 08master @ 41a24375 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/14131044435 07:56:42 03radio-gra02 {GitHub} 07* 0.33-a0-1149-g9fdd3ef415: Mark maxed out misc evokers as useless if not in player's inventory (#4402) 10(15 seconds ago, 1 file, 5+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9fdd3ef41555 07:59:10 <06mumra> @hellmonk Re #3832 just had another look at it and i think i still agree with what i wrote, i.e. return the number x100 (and in their last reply they misunderstand the math, i think, although i haven't checked this on paper to make sure) 08:00:50 <06mumra> although my point about the 0.5 damage increase ... i'm not sure if it matters ..? if you've trained a skill halfway to another whole point increase, it seems fair to sometimes get an extra point of damage and it probably doesn't matter in a problematic way over a single fight? 08:03:05 <06mumra> it does seem it would be weird to say e.g. "100 max damage" when your chance of getting 100 is about 0.01% but it would be technically correct... 08:06:25 <09hellmonk> if I'm not mistaken, the damage change would be roughly equivalent to giving all players +1 slaying 08:07:26 <09hellmonk> but I haven't looked at what your soultion would do to damage at all, might be good to test both and compare 08:08:01 <09hellmonk> esp if it's equally easy to do either 08:10:55 <06mumra> it's slightly more complex, you have to tweak everywhere that calls it, it's only 5 places but still 08:11:06 <09hellmonk> oh, 5 places is not bad at all 08:11:13 <06mumra> i make it that it averages +0.5 slaying 08:11:33 <09hellmonk> there are some functions that get called like 40 places and updating those would be a nightmare 08:11:41 <06mumra> it depends how close to a breakpoint you are 08:11:57 <06mumra> yep for sure, 5 is a cakewalk 08:12:47 <06mumra> only 40 places? for wall monsters i had to tangle with cell_is_solid which has 182 callers 08:12:57 <09hellmonk> yuck 08:14:58 <06mumra> (which is why that's a difficult PR to merge, i update a lot of those to a different function to check "is it solid but not a monster there", so it updates a lot of places) 08:21:04 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-ge7530ccad1: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1214+ 471-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e7530ccad131 08:21:05 <06mumra> so for #3832 i think you just subtract 50 before dividing if you want the damage change to be neutral ... but then it's possible this has a significant early game impact on some combos, depending where their starting stats are relative to the breakpoint 09:00:11 03hellmonk02 07[slimeshroudredux] * 0.33-a0-1084-g81a474ef34: shroud status description 10(50 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/81a474ef34a3 09:00:12 Branch pull/4367 updated to be equal with slimeshroudredux: 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4367 10:32:11 03mumra02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4406 * 0.33-a0-1136-g86349f72be: Tweak trash logic 10(13 minutes ago, 1 file, 42+ 49-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/86349f72be5e 10:32:11 03mumra02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4406 * 0.33-a0-1137-gafbf37b985: Tweak shop placement variance 10(12 minutes ago, 1 file, 9+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/afbf37b98590 10:37:29 03mumra02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4406 * 0.33-a0-1137-g809e5e4565: Tweak shop placement variance 10(46 seconds ago, 1 file, 9+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/809e5e45659b 13:13:04 Sweetruy1997 (L7 CoFw) ASSERT(in_bounds(p)) in 'player.cc' at line 627 failed. (p = (0,0)) (D:4) 15:10:29 <06mumra> !crashlog Sweetruy1997 15:10:31 <04Cerebot> 5. Sweetruy1997, XL7 CoFw, T:4284 (milestone): https://cbro.berotato.org/morgue/Sweetruy1997/crash-Sweetruy1997-20250328-201256.txt 15:21:39 <06pleasingfungus> https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4411 makes me really leery 15:21:48 <06pleasingfungus> we removed old protection ego for a reason 15:22:19 <06pleasingfungus> other staves' elemental resists are sketchy, but at least they affect a small fraction of monsters. This staff of earth change would be something you'd want by default 15:22:34 <06pleasingfungus> inclined to close the PR with a comment along these lines (slightly longer) unless others disagree 15:34:34 <06pleasingfungus> sorry, just saw you typing after i hit 'close' 15:34:44 <06mumra> Would be nice for it to have something but yeah AC doesn't actually make it distinctive 15:36:03 <06pleasingfungus> hot take: remove staff of earth 15:36:08 <06pleasingfungus> symmetry is for dweebs 15:36:26 <06pleasingfungus> the three elements: fire, ice, and air 15:36:51 <06mumra> poison is the 4th element 15:38:04 <06mumra> This crash is weird ... they got polymorphed into a pig which melded their Fly dagger so they landed. they climbed some stairs, and appear to land again at which point they end up at (0,0) 15:41:21 <06mumra> oh so they're loading their game, and the unequip effects are getting applied during game load? 15:43:55 <06mumra> no that's not right 15:44:25 <06mumra> i'm not sure how it goes from load_level to tag_read 15:52:10 tags.cc:1574 says it's going through get_forced_removal_list during load 15:52:30 *level load 15:52:48 <06mumra> yeah they also end up in _restore_tagged_chunk with "Level file is invalid." 15:53:50 <06mumra> is it maybe a save from a version before pregeneration and it's trying to generate the level? 15:54:06 from what I can see that isn't a cause, it's something to report if loading the level chunk fails 15:55:27 <06mumra> it's a coglin forgewright so yeah it's a pretty new game 15:57:00 also missing pregens is handled before that 15:57:27 <09hellmonk> don't like removing earth staff in isolation, do like removing enhancer staves and moving enhancer properties to nonweapon slots 16:01:15 <09gammafunk> what about enhancer staff melee 16:01:35 <09gammafunk> the fabled BATTLEMAGE 16:06:27 <09hellmonk> idk make new weapons that do that effect 16:07:24 <09hellmonk> Staff swapping bad having to trade off damage with defensive properties good etc etc 16:12:26 <06mumra> putting spell enhancers on orbs seems to me it'd make a lot of sense 16:12:47 <06regret-⸸nde※> I think I'd just prefer removing most of the swapping between multiple staves or swapping staves mid-combat by requiring full MP in order to get the enhancer when wielding the weapon, somewhat akin to the way amulets of magic regeneration work. 16:13:12 <04dracoomega> You could still start every fight that way and then swap off, though 16:13:34 <06regret-⸸nde※> It's true, but it's still fairly better off than swapping on regularly. 16:13:56 <06regret-⸸nde※> Orb randarts already can get spell school enhancers and still aren't that tempting because most of the base egos aren't good for most characters at the time they're found. 16:14:04 <04dracoomega> About the unequip crash, it's probably (yet another?) bug with items popping off between floors because the game thinks they're not supposed to be on the player (code I'd originally thought was only on save load, before learning this also happens every staircase.) In this case, the crash is because removing flight items is 'unsafe' at that point because the player isn't actually on their proper tile yet, I think. 16:15:19 <04dracoomega> (I will have to look into the specifics a bit more at some future time, but that is the likely culprit) 16:16:13 <06regret-⸸nde※> (If nothing else, the worst sin of staff swapping to me is being tempted to use more than one staff for different spell schools, since the weapon quickswap key is readily arranged for one slot and not more than that.) 16:16:31 <04dracoomega> That is a fair point 16:18:22 <04dracoomega> I do think the enhancer staff melee system (and training involved in it) is sort of interesting, even as-is. Would making enhancer staves slow-wield make one more likely to want to do this or less? (Like, is it flattening to feel you'd have to go into that form of melee if you wanted the enhancer, over other weapons?) 16:19:43 <06regret-⸸nde※> People did twist themselves into knots over archmagi robes when those weren't absurdly rare.... 16:20:28 <04dracoomega> (I do feel that this was maybe overshot a bit) 16:35:37 -!- The topic of #crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | https://github.com/crawl/crawl | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/, temporarily http://crawl.akrasiac.org/logs/cheibriados/ | People with +v have commit access, devs on bridged discord as well | General Crawl-related chat to #crawl | Long stuff to a pastebin service, please 16:35:37 -!- The topic of #crawl is: Play Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup online now! Type ??online for instructions, ??lg / !lg for play stats | PM Sequell for long queries | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV game replays: ??footv for instructions | #crawl-dev for dev discussion, #crawl-offtopic for offtopic 16:38:49 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.33-a0-1149-g9fdd3ef415 (34) 17:40:10 <02Monkooky> Does in-combat weapon swapping have a compelling reason to exist besides hydrae? 17:53:55 <04dracoomega> Stabbing, some polearm things (especially earlygame), relevant brands for different situations, at the very least. (Personally I feel like these are fine and that some in-combat swapping isn't a design problem. I feel like enhancer staves stand out partially because you want to swap them more, but also because which one you want for which situation is a lot more of a 'rote' thing (which, as Index says, can be especially bad when 17:53:56 you have multiple staves to switch between regularly for your normal spell kit, like an air staff for plasma beam and conj for your other fire/conj spells.) 17:55:13 <06regret-⸸nde※> relevant brands for different situations We struggle enough with having any weapon brands of interest as is without making people e.g. completely ignore early poison weapons because it then takes 5 turns to swap away in front of every ice beast and wight. 17:57:11 <04dracoomega> I mean, I think early poison weapons are good enough that the reverse situation is what would happen, and you'd just accept them being unbranded against wights 17:57:20 <04dracoomega> However, I don't actually think this would be more interesting than present 17:58:20 <04dracoomega> (Earlygame in particular can end up with more situational weapon swapping, I think, because you're less invested in any particular skill or any particular weapon, via scrolls. At least, I feel it's not uncommon to end up with a small grab-bag of different weapons for different situations, and I feel this is... largely a positive thing?) 18:03:18 <09hellmonk> While I'm a big fan of swapless strategic-equip systems I do think you have to cut pretty deep to make it functional for crawl 18:05:22 <04dracoomega> (I was actually saying something similar to Index just now, actually. Certainly, I've played games where choosing weapons or other equipment that you can't swap between for a while afterward is an interesting and nuanced/tricky decision, but I feel like... in those, generally the consequences of the items you're choosing between is a bunch... bigger. Either because they're all more complicated individually, or they have strategic 18:05:22 consequences for future decisions in a way that Crawl's largely don't.) 18:06:43 <04dracoomega> (For that matter, Crawl does tend to get some of this by midgame on a lot of characters, when you've tossed a lot of scrolls onto a good weapon such that it's clearly your best option for most fights, regardless of what it is) 18:06:56 <04dracoomega> In terms of 'Have made a longer-term choice' 18:07:32 <04dracoomega> (Sometimes artifacts still give you alternate options, of course, and by lategame you can often have alternate normal ones, too.) 18:09:01 <09hellmonk> One nice thing that no fast swapping would allow is differentiating weapon brands a bit more than damage color that checks a resist. But I think you'd want to make the brand system first and then do the swap change if you were going that route 18:16:28 <06regret-⸸nde※> One of the difficulties of making more complicated weapon brands is that a lot of the space feels like it's already been taken up by Translocations, rampage, WJC, reaching, and cleaving already. Additional AOE sizes would interact weirdly with reaching and cleaving, additional debuffs are stepping hard in a place the three different spell schools + needles are already struggling to fill up, and additional activated abilities 18:16:29 would intersect heavily with WJC and Translocations. 18:17:43 <06regret-⸸nde※> (...A fair amount of melee complexity is probably coming with some of the new talisman forms, admittedly, but those are naturally far more mutually exclusive and opt-in and unswappable as is.) 18:18:21 <06regret-⸸nde※> Did you have any ideas on what said brand differentiation would entail? 18:19:31 <09hellmonk> If I had a genius brand proposal I would have pitched it a long time ago. I think I more or less agree with you that it's hard to find design space. 18:19:38 <04dracoomega> Yeah, I'm certainly in favor of more interesting brands. Honestly, a fair number of Crawl's are fairly bland (even the elemental ones often care only a little about what you're using them against). But it does seem a bit of a tall order in the game's current context. (There are a bunch of fancy/splashy things, but most of them end up as unrands with commensurate power attached to them) 18:19:44 <06regret-⸸nde※> Fair enough. 18:20:05 <09hellmonk> hellcrawl made fire brand work similar to the funny explosion spell I'm pitching but I think that's as far as I got 18:24:28 <09hellmonk> even my notes for a very ambitious no swap fork don't really have any brand stuff suitable for mainline, it's either changing numbers or some stuff that only makes sense with other planned fork mechanics 18:25:13 <04dracoomega> Really, unrands do have a lot of fun things they do that could make sense for default weapon modifiers in some game, but are often at present wildly stronger than norma brands 18:25:38 <04dracoomega> And only 'balanced' by rarity 18:26:27 <06regret-⸸nde※> ...It'd also be quite a lot in enemy hands to be throwing around disarming or power bolts or discharge brands on top of an arbitrary element, of course :P 18:29:06 <04dracoomega> Of course, having more interesting gear is generally more fun than having less. (I've never been exactly fond of how much extremely vanilla aux armour there is either, for instance. Not from a player power perspective, but just 'Deciding between cool things is more fun' perspective. 18:29:22 <04dracoomega> More common/better gear modifiers and nerf the player in other systemic ways, clearly >.> 18:29:34 <09hellmonk> honestly not a bad idea 18:29:53 <04dracoomega> Yeah, I don't think it's unreasonable, but it's probably a tall order also 18:29:54 <09hellmonk> though I think coming up with good aux ego is also quite hard 18:30:10 <09hellmonk> rampage being the only big recent success in that regard I think 18:30:38 <04dracoomega> I guess it depends on how much you want to lean into 'more cool stuff for players in more danger' thing (in terms of difficulty of accomplishing) 18:31:44 <09hellmonk> Made 12 new armor egos. Removed blink scroll 18:31:52 <09hellmonk> good luck have fun 18:32:33 <04dracoomega> On the more tractable end of things, I am suddenly wondering if it might be possible to balance some higher-impact brands by having them increase the skill needed for mindelay on the weapon they were on. Not like just making it generally slower, like heavy does, but 'more investment to use this well' that could counterbalance them being otherwise above-the-curve? Or, honestly, even brands that care about your actual skill with the 18:32:33 weapon in a more direct way, maybe? (Sort of like how Pain works, but with the skill of the weapon it's on.) 18:32:59 <06regret-⸸nde※> Finally, curving back to putting enhancer staff brands on lajatangs. 18:33:06 <04dracoomega> Ha 18:33:49 <09hellmonk> there probably is some room for more pain-like brand mechanics 18:34:29 <09hellmonk> I think a long time ago someone pitched making a lot of brands work like that on tavern, but it didn't catch on at the time 18:34:52 <09hellmonk> possible I'm misremembering and their specific idea was really bad or something tho 18:36:14 <06regret-⸸nde※> (Aside from whether or not a lajatang of cold could sufficiently tempt somebody who has a staff of cold and a buckler, it honestly just makes me think about how... four? of the upcoming forms will have incidental single-school support on top of their melee capacities and other upsides.) 18:37:24 <04dracoomega> Yeah, I've specifically tried to scatter around a few thematically-appropriate bonuses to things one mightn't normally try to do in that form 18:37:44 <09hellmonk> This laj of cold talk makes me wonder if we should just change enhancer staves to be two handed by default 18:37:50 <04dracoomega> (Like school-specific wizardry or enhancers to a given element) 18:37:58 <09hellmonk> with whatever requisite buff to their melee numbers 18:38:53 <09hellmonk> I guess it amounts to the same thing 18:39:03 <04dracoomega> To be honest, I'd wonder more if that would need a buff to their spell enhancement. At the very least, I feel like enhancers are used in a number of situations because they are close to free if you have access to a relevant one 18:39:35 <04dracoomega> And I am not sure exactly how competitive they'd be if they were two-handed (but perhaps I am wrong there; it's just a first impression) 18:39:56 <04dracoomega> Mostly I feel like when they were two-handed on kobolds, I just didn't use one, at least >.> 18:43:24 <06regret-⸸nde※> Clearly the one-handed staff stays at one enhancer and the two-handed two-bladed staff gets two enhancers. 18:43:39 <02Monkooky> here's a pitch- fold painesque brand and enhancer together 18:44:10 <02Monkooky> I've not through the pitch very much yet mind 18:45:33 <09hellmonk> lol 18:49:23 <04dracoomega> You say that with strikethrough, but I'm not sure that I think this is a bad idea 18:51:54 <09hellmonk> add manavamp laj brand 19:11:42 <04Cgettys> RE: staff of earth, maybe steadfast, from one of the boot unrands? but then that takes away its distinctivenss a bit 19:14:05 <04Cgettys> bring back per species gear 😛 . No please don't 19:15:13 <04Cgettys> Hard to it either being non-distinctive or OP, I think, yeah. Needs more work: https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4378 19:15:58 <04Cgettys> That's a fun idea 19:16:09 <04Cgettys> Here's a nutty, probably terrible idea 19:16:13 <04Cgettys> or set of terrible ideas 19:16:33 <04Cgettys> fold ring of fire and fire protection together (lose the rC-?) and same for ice 19:16:41 <06dolorous_84348> Maybe if there was an unrand piece of armor: the last piece of orcish armor from the old days, before they were driven from the hills. (In actual practice, it's just an ordinary piece of armor with "BEOGH IS AWESOME" crudely carved into it. Although that's more flavor than anything. 19:16:42 <04Cgettys> fold the brands and enhancers together 19:24:17 <04Cgettys> so now antimagic == nothing, it wouldn't make sense chaos == ??? draining == hexes?? (feels like it overlaps to necro too - but hexes doesn't have another home in this list) electrocution == air distortion == translocation flaming == fire enhancer freezing == ice heavy == doesn't need anything, but maybe earth, since it doesn't have a better choice Holy wrath == ??? pain == necro (even today) Protection == ??? (probably nothing) 19:24:18 Spectral == summoning?? speed == ?? vampiric == ??? (maybe shapeshifting, but seems silly and not really magic skill) venom == alchemy 19:24:21 <06pleasingfungus> 2h enhancer staves would be a brutal nerf to poor orb of energion 19:25:52 <04Cgettys> hmm, here's an idea 19:26:03 <04Cgettys> based on @dracoomega's recent hard works 19:26:11 <04Cgettys> what if we made enhancer staves have an orb slot? 19:26:19 <04Cgettys> So you could do enhancer staff + shield + orb 😄 19:26:50 <06pleasingfungus> wow 19:27:32 <04Cgettys> Wow good or wow bad? 19:29:31 <06pleasingfungus> just wow. 19:29:40 <06pleasingfungus> i refuse to commit to a more decisive viewpoint at this time. 19:29:53 <04Cgettys> I don't have a decisive viewpoint at this time either 19:30:09 <04Cgettys> I just thought it was an interesting thought exercise 😄 19:30:28 <04Cgettys> Easy to throw out crazy ideas, hard to make them balanced and play well... 😄 19:31:14 <04Cgettys> It does at least sound like an interesting idea for a fork to play with to me. If I ever had time or inclination to spin up my own fork 😄 19:31:53 <06pleasingfungus> clearly this means you could have two orbs 19:31:56 <06pleasingfungus> (tworbs) 19:32:12 <04Cgettys> we were talking about a unrand that let you have 3 for april fools a while back I think 19:32:15 <04Cgettys> no plans to actually do it 19:32:17 <04dracoomega> The idea of two-handed staves you can 'customize' with an orb of your choice is honestly cute, but I think that depends on orbs themselves being more appealing than they currently are. (Which is something I also want to work on in future!) 19:32:28 <04Cgettys> but if we're gonna, we'd need to move on it 😄 19:32:29 <06pleasingfungus> mom can i have staff orb slot? / to have shield + orb? / yess / ... 19:32:32 <04dracoomega> I am just imagining physically slotting it in at top 19:32:38 <04Cgettys> Right, exactly! 19:33:13 <04Cgettys> Probably could even just make it hover over teh top of existing ones 19:33:23 <04Cgettys> (or make awesome art for it, but I'm not so good at the art part of things) 19:33:30 <06regret-⸸nde※> (Such orb work probably a half a year away at this point, considering the talisman work is being split across this version and next version, then Hell-Pan Roulette's finally being stabbed at, then she wants to go add a lot more evoker types next....) 19:35:46 <04Cgettys> Good things come to those who wait, or something like that 19:36:37 <04Cgettys> Juggler's gloves of threeorbs discussion is here 19:38:23 <06dolorous_84348> That gives me an idea. Maybe have a bit of flavor regarding troves: if the item it needs is an orb, maybe use the flavor that the locked door equivalent is the skull of a cyclops and you put the orb in the eye socket? Although something like that will need tiles, and that seems like a lot of work for flavor. (My muse is working right now, in weird directions, yes, but it's working.) 19:38:53 <04Cgettys> You could get some mileage out of the tile at least 19:38:59 <04Cgettys> or at least the exercise 19:39:11 <04Cgettys> you make a variant of it with 3 sockets for Zot, you see 19:39:18 <04Cgettys> but shaped a tiny bit different 19:39:32 <06dolorous_84348> Unfortunately, I'm not really an artist, but I get what you mean. 19:39:57 <04Cgettys> Neither am I, I'm afraid 19:40:01 <06dolorous_84348> The 3-socketed one for Zot does sound cool. 19:40:06 <04Cgettys> Unless you consider software an art, which I kinda do 😄 19:40:16 <06dolorous_84348> I do, yes,. 19:40:24 <04Cgettys> (it's both art and science/engineering, IMO) 19:41:25 <06dolorous_84348> The most sophisticated drawing-type art I've done is recoloring the eveningstar for Brilliance, and some crude edits of mostly Calvin and Hobbes, but the latter is for something else entirely. 19:41:26 <04Cgettys> hmm, dumb convoluted way to achieve this... you take the item, and you use it as a mask 19:41:35 <04Cgettys> so that you generalize 19:41:58 <04Cgettys> you if necessary shift the item (ideally we do this in code, rather than making someone do it for every item) so that the outline is reasonably well centered 19:42:20 <04Cgettys> e.g. you have like, a top texture,a nd a bottom texture, and wherever the item would fit, you show the bottom texture 19:42:43 <04Cgettys> (yes it would require a lot of work to make that rendering work / create the texture, but it's not that bad) 19:42:45 <06dolorous_84348> I'm suddenly thinking the Inquisitor's mask from that Red Dwarf episode, but with 3 eye sockets. (Some oni are also supposed to have 3 eyes, right?) 19:43:09 <06dolorous_84348> As inspiration, I mean. 19:43:53 <06dolorous_84348> Doing textures from scratch is... tricky, at least for me. 19:43:55 <04Cgettys> Sorry, I'm too young to remember that one and haven't gotten to watching it yet 19:44:19 <04Cgettys> (I'm cultured, I watched Babylon 5 and the like... just not Red Dwarf, yet, don't judge!) 19:45:17 <06dolorous_84348> No problem. I never watched much of Babylon 5, but I did a lot of DS9 and Red Dwarf. Not to mention Starhunter. 19:45:39 <06dolorous_84348> The image I'm thinking of is here: 19:45:41 <06dolorous_84348> https://reddwarf.co.uk/episodes/theinquisitor/ 19:45:54 <06dolorous_84348> I mean, on that page. 19:46:34 <04Cgettys> that's terrifying 19:47:23 <06dolorous_84348> Yes, and given that he's supposed to go around time deleting people whom he's judged to live worthless lives and replacing them with new ones, terrifying is the idea. 21:06:39 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-g858bf193cf: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1240+ 472-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/858bf193cff3 21:15:07 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-g51878c3650: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1238+ 472-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/51878c36509a 21:34:09 03WizardIke02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/4383 * 0.33-a0-1135-gc1b211ed1b: Call some tiles rendering code less often 10(11 days ago, 23 files, 1239+ 472-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c1b211ed1b84 23:16:09 Unstable branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1149-g9fdd3ef415 (34) 23:35:37 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1149-g9fdd3ef415 (34) 23:58:21 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1149-g9fdd3ef415 23:59:07 <06mumra> Amazing episode ... (I literally grew up on this series)