00:55:38 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1084-g778f541198 01:11:13 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.33-a0-1085-g789d534dee: Fix Enkindled spells never failing (cool3) 10(71 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/789d534dee15 02:55:00 <12ge0ff> there was an interesting Reddit post a couple of days ago: https://old.reddit.com/r/dcss/comments/1j7yxyn/api_for_dcss_webtiles_in_rust_and_python/ > I created a Python and Rust API for DCSS. It works as a base for a bot. Currently, you can connect to DCSS Webtile, create / login to a user, start a game and move during the game. 02:55:20 <12ge0ff> (https://github.com/EricFecteau/dcss-api) 03:16:47 <06mumra> The start_game_with_scenario is an interesting approach ... it's basically a way of building a multi-level sprint 03:17:40 <06mumra> (Otherwise it largely seems to be a wrapper around the existing webtiles websocket interface, so you can't do as much with it as Lua) 03:22:56 <06mumra> This kind of interface would be more interesting after the changes i'm thinking about for emscripten webtiles ... then you'd have the whole game state available (everything that's available to Lua anyway) and go wild with stuff like machine learning 04:33:39 Experimental (bcrawl) branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-5261-gd9800d219b 05:08:11 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1085-g789d534 (34) 08:21:29 03DracoOmega02 07* 0.33-a0-1086-g610cef96e5: Don't prompt for each individual bad Static Discharge target (staticshock) 10(2 minutes ago, 4 files, 44+ 25-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/610cef96e5c2 09:19:27 -!- MaxFrost56 is now known as MaxFrost 10:06:40 <09hellmonk> Does anyone remember a post about "level feelings"? Can't remember who made it or where it is 10:12:53 <04dracoomega> Like, something Angband-esque? (I can't recall anyone saying it in a Crawl context, at any rate) 10:18:17 <09hellmonk> It was a very old post, I think a proposed alternative to explore traps when those were first implemented? 10:18:26 <09hellmonk> I don't fully recall the context 10:18:48 <04dracoomega> (Are you familiar with the term in Angband usage, out of curiousity?) 10:20:01 <04dracoomega> (For anyone who may not be, Angband has infinite non-persistent (and large) dungeon floors, and a lot of them are pretty uninteresting. And 'level feelings' can alert the player on entering a floor that there is a major vault or something of actual value to make it worth staying on this floor as opposed to one of infinitely many others you could go to instead) 10:22:50 <06regret-⸸nde※> (The equivalent of Spelunky's level feelings I guess would be announced serial vaults, and Crawl's aren't super impressive or easily further stretched as is with our limited terrain or decoration or description options. It'd be mildly cute to have minor decorative vaults use serial vault code to extend a theme out from larger cross-game theme vaults, like the ones I've made over the past year at the bottom of large_themed.des, 10:22:51 I guess?) 10:24:36 <06regret-⸸nde※> (Possibly a bunch more could be done with flavourful buff and/or debuff traps if there were more monster buffs to work with, but aside from a large space of "temporarily grant spell knowledge" to also incidentally fix things like Vehumet / Sif wrath, I don't have a lot more of that plotted out.) 10:47:29 <05icoson> https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=26016 10:49:29 <05icoson> there was discussion in the irc channel about that that also included implojin 10:49:52 <05icoson> https://s-z.org/crawl-dev/%23%23crawl-dev-20191118.lg 10:52:54 <05icoson> tbc the level feeling stuff is in the followup 10:59:54 <09hellmonk> thanks 11:54:27 <06regret-⸸nde※> Outright irresistably changing play rules per-floor or in sight of a feature is hypothetically of high interest on a raw mechanical front, but troubled in a game where we're constantly harried over stairdancing and shouting-in-place optimality in default play. Some loose equivalents are part of plans to vary up floors in Hell-Pan Roulette, which should be able to avoid such matters twice over between no stairs and still 11:54:28 retaining somewhat-rapid monster respawns. I do sympathize with the desire to spice up three-rune games more regularly, though. 11:56:42 <06regret-⸸nde※> (Descent may also help some of this, and with a large number of ambush vaults + stair vaults being absent in that mode there's hypothetically some room for mechanical maliciousness to help make it fancier, but I've been uncertain as to how well the recent attempts at fix-ups have worked out, since I've been quite preoccupied with my own projects or testing Draco's.) 12:10:37 hellmonk: thanks for *Silence BTW 12:13:19 <09hellmonk> I had specific ideas for minimizing the value of stair dance and luring in a level feeling format, will post a sketch of it later when I'm not at work 12:14:01 <04dracoomega> Well, I believe I have deduced today that the answer to this 9 year old comment question is: No C++ // XXX: does interrupt_activity() add 'comes into view' messages to // 'msgs' in ALL cases we want shoutitis/gozag wrath to trigger? 12:14:09 <04dracoomega> Shoutitis and Gozag wrath are also handled in a second place in addition to this, which might cover the shortfall of this location, though this is the only place that attractitis is processed (if it were actually enabled at the moment), and in general the whole thing is somewhat confusing. 12:15:04 <04dracoomega> (I discovered this as I tried to add another 'Chance to do the first time a monster is seen' thing in the same place that a lot of them were clustered and it only sometimes working) 12:16:54 <04dracoomega> As best I can tell, the issue is that there's at least a half-dozen (or more) places that a monster can be announced as coming into view before we scan and do the 'combine multiple monsters coming into view into one message'. And if they are, then they aren't seen by the point of this comment and its subsequent handling. 12:17:53 <04dracoomega> This can be observed in a fairly easy manner by having something that could trigger off monsters being recalled by a convoker. Some of them will be eligable for the effect and some won't. (Seemingly at random, but probably based on what they did or their energy level at the time) 12:20:51 <04dracoomega> (Having to do things in multiple places is not ideal, and there's message awkwardness with some configurations of this - like messages for reacting to a monster happening 'before' they come into view) 14:13:01 <06pleasingfungus> the logic for having things trigger on 'comes into view' is deeply distressing in several ways, iirc 14:13:16 <06pleasingfungus> one of the areas of crawl code that i prefer not to think about 14:13:44 <06pleasingfungus> among other things, "you see an entity" doesn't seem like it should in itself trigger effects 14:33:32 <08wormsofcan> made some april fool tiles if anyone wants to implement them (zip has the doll tiles) 14:33:32 <08wormsofcan> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747522859361894521/1349857938080137359/aprilfooltiles.png?ex=67d4a0ab&is=67d34f2b&hm=414efa9384751fc84db12b0205e3cd079b02f2bb7617abc32d5f1ddd10010e70& 14:33:33 <08wormsofcan> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747522859361894521/1349857938289725460/aprilfooltiles.zip?ex=67d4a0ab&is=67d34f2b&hm=852eb4b57ba73e964eb1ca9a7c5616e6ce523f23cb1cb817ac7c1a0036a782bb& 15:18:55 <09hellmonk> Marvelous 15:32:59 <09hellmonk> Hmm, I think implojin deadass had the right direction for this level feeling stuff 9 years ago 15:33:31 <09hellmonk> Specifically tying it to the disgaea mechanic that lifts the effect when you destroy the tile 15:34:50 <09hellmonk> What a legend 15:50:09 <06regret-⸸nde※> I'm... not entirely convinced that the equivalent of adding a dozen aura buff statues to the game would end up avoiding constant luring unless it's all shoved into teleporter vaults? 15:52:32 <06regret-⸸nde※> (Shiren 2 64 statues and Rift Wizard 1 / 2's idols do work in roguelike contexts, but mostly because the former is in a format that was fine with grinding exploits + complicated interactions being the default, and the latter works because there's extremely heavy clocks + an absence of stairs to dance on.) 16:04:22 <06regret-⸸nde※> (...Honestly, there might be a bunch of room for more entirely-optional vaults when I'm done with Necropolis here, though, and the teleporter vaults are fairly better off than runed door vaults, so a little exerpeimentation in such for such wouldn't be too out of place. I've actually thought the game could use a small amount more statue types for lategame purposes as is....) 16:39:10 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.33-a0-1086-g610cef96e5 (34) 18:11:06 shadowrider38 (L23 ReIE) ASSERT(defender() && defender()->is_monster()) in 'fineff.cc' at line 707 failed. (Depths:4) 18:44:02 <06mumra> Has anyone experienced a problem with local builds where the player tile doesn't render (or monsters, but anything else like dungeon features and items on the ground are rendering) 18:45:13 <06mumra> Building from master ... tried a make clean first ... I'm running things through WSL which was working fine on my other laptop but I just switched to a different laptop and I'm having the issue here 19:56:04 Not the usual `make -j` problem? 20:09:10 <09hellmonk> you're welcome. Still deciding if I should remove it from maxwell's and doom knight in favor of something else 20:20:18 <06cao> Renew Success by crawl Success certs: crawl.akrasiac.org_ecc 21:28:19 <09hellmonk> Problem: Explore traps lead to interesting gameplay (forced play off stairs, in immediate danger, without ability to lure) but feel bad psychologically. Players feel like the game is screwing them over for something out of their control. Explore traps also further disincentivize exploring levels after earlygame; once individual item drops are no longer significant, it's best to kill as many monsters as possible before exploring to 21:28:19 minimize risk from mark and teleport. Proposal: Instead of explore traps, some levels have an announced “Zot shrine” feature. It will spawn only on connected levels that allow explore traps currently, and the approximate location will be revealed when it is announced. While the shrine exists on the level, stairs are sealed and a persistent effect occurs – this could be forced teleportitis, buffed monsters, a negative terrain or trap spawn that 21:28:20 affects only the player, etc. Destroying the shrine by walking onto it removes the level effect and unseals the stairs. I think some mechanic along these lines could preserve the fun part of explore traps, feel more like an element of dungeon generation rather than an element of player punishment, and encourage more frontloaded exploration of some levels. 21:28:35 <09hellmonk> someone tell me if I'm cooking or not 21:31:25 <09hellmonk> forgot to say: the feature would place using some kind of away from stairs logic so that reaching it is likely to be nontrivial 22:04:53 <09gammafunk> it sounds pretty harsh as a penalty 22:05:27 <09gammafunk> also sounds like it doesn't work at all with shafts? 22:06:14 <09gammafunk> but in terms of the penalty, you'd be subjected to the resulting effect for a much longer time on-average compared to an exploration trap as it exists currently 22:07:08 <09gammafunk> not to mention the stair sealing 22:31:59 <08wormsofcan> connected level means every cell you can teleport onto can be visited by a non-flying/aquatic/etc species? 23:11:06 <06pleasingfungus> shafts are presumably mostly ex-effects with this setup 23:11:28 <06pleasingfungus> i'm mildly positive about this idea (it has a lot of words that i tend to like) but should probably ruminate on it further before giving pronouncements 23:21:28 Unstable branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1086-g610cef96e5 (34) 23:35:26 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1086-g610cef96e5 (34) 23:58:10 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.33-a0-1086-g610cef96e5