00:12:50 Unstable branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.32-a0-131-g9dbbe29261 (34) 01:34:30 Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.32-a0-131-g9dbbe29261 (34) 01:34:31 Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.32-a0-131-g9dbbe29261 (34) 01:36:19 Fork (bcrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-5140-g5775ae71e1 01:36:20 Fork (bcrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-5140-g5775ae71e1 04:32:07 Experimental (bcrawl) branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-5140-g5775ae71e1 05:07:24 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.32-a0-131-g9dbbe29 (34) 06:52:51 <05icoson> seems ok? 08:06:23 <09gammafunk> @pleasingfungus are you talking about the CDO daily trunk builds? 08:06:54 <09gammafunk> those are indeed stuck on 0.31-a 08:07:18 <09gammafunk> I think we need to do the usual switch on CDO (which I always forget how to do and maybe @icoson remembers how) 08:07:54 <09gammafunk> I can find the instructions in the discord from the last time when I have a bit more time in a couple hours, but anyone who wants to who has CDO access, feel free to do it first 08:12:03 <05icoson> Have a look in tileweb.cc at the part of _send_cell with if (fg_idx == TILEP_PLAYER) ... it's sent only when it changes so if you're inspecting actual messages you might not see it often. This mostly uses a different code path send_doll unless the player is using a monster tile in their rc 09:30:07 <05alexjurkiewicz> thanks. I did some digging. It seems like the name isn't really a cache at all. mcache data is really "monster doll" where the parts of a monster tile are sent -- for monsters that use layered tiles. (monsters using a single tile don't use mcache, which is why I missed it at the start while testing with rats) 09:31:54 <05alexjurkiewicz> I bashed through tiles rendering today ❤️ thanks for your helpful words! 09:31:54 <05alexjurkiewicz> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747522859361894521/1205189268998201454/Screenshot_2024-02-09_at_00-25-21_Crawl_Webserver.png?ex=65d776f9&is=65c501f9&hm=38ced0bfc817dbb90e2158cfe5dacd9e93b4b54d32a2eab4f438088adfdae60b& 10:20:01 <09gammafunk> nice, have you looked at our client js packaging and how that works? Years ago when we started that infamous webtiles-changes branch, I started trying to update js dependencies 10:20:13 <09gammafunk> but that code is arcane indeed 10:20:27 <09gammafunk> gave me the sense that a lot of js client stuff is a total wild west 10:20:47 <09gammafunk> I think we're still using a very out of date version of jquery 11:01:36 03dolorous02 07[neoyred_and_newbeogh] * 0.32-a0-116-g6d0fb9ac72: Fix typos. 10(3 days ago, 2 files, 7+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6d0fb9ac7262 11:48:37 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.32-a0-132-g2d33c3cfaf: Fix Gastronok's corpse (FPSBOSSFIGHT) 10(38 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2d33c3cfafa3 14:54:50 <04dracoomega> Working on tweaking monster Vhi's as was requested last time it was discussed (ie: make it do flat electrical damage regardless of range of the base attack's damage) and actually wondering what this means doing for the spell description. I don't think there's a way to make wording tweaks for player/monster versions of spells (or orb of destruction wouldn't be written the way it is) and wonder if that means we ought to make a second 14:54:51 similarly-named spell that just shares codepath? "Vhi's Crackling Dash" or something? >.> 14:55:03 <04dracoomega> Feels very silly, but I'm not sure a better alternative if people do want it changed 14:56:02 <06pleasingfungus> that was my suggestion when this came up before, yeah 14:56:22 <06pleasingfungus> https://discord.com/channels/735056636644687913/747522859361894521/1201317323529781338 > yeah i was imagining "vhi's crackling advance" or something 14:57:51 <04dracoomega> Fair enough 14:58:15 <04dracoomega> I wonder if my subconscious remembered the adjective without realizing or if it really is the next obvious thing? ^^; 15:51:12 <05alexjurkiewicz> so far I've ignored it. I don't think it will be a requirement for me. I'll aim for "trunk + latest stable" compat only. In modern webapp parlance apps made up of multiple compiled "sub-apps" are called Microfrontends. The tech is there, but it's not widely used 16:35:38 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.32-a0-132-g2d33c3cfaf (34) 16:50:13 <09gammafunk> Seems reasonable. By the way, what are you targeting exactly in terms of improvements? I understand if you don't have a writeup, but a quick summary? Happy to have someone working on the WebTiles client either way. 17:32:21 <05alexjurkiewicz> this all started when I wanted to make three webtiles improvements: * Global chat (ability to chat in lobby and with people playing while you are playing) * A clickable button to pop up the help menu * Tooltips when hovering over the map But I very quickly pivoted to "reimplement webtiles client with a modern JS stack". (So far, that's 95% React 5% small libs.) At the moment I have an MVP: you can log in and play a game to 17:32:21 completion. There are plenty of rendering issues and the architecture needs cleanup, but it feels like a viable base 17:33:59 <06pleasingfungus> awesome! 🙂 17:34:06 <06pleasingfungus> i'm very scared of global chat 17:34:15 <06pleasingfungus> but everything else you mentioned sounds amazing 17:34:36 <06pleasingfungus> (i have never seen global chat exist in any game that was not a cesspool) 17:35:56 <06pleasingfungus> i'm especially excited for tooltips, i love tooltips and long for more of them 17:36:02 <05alexjurkiewicz> that's fair 😄 17:37:27 <05alexjurkiewicz> If anyone is interested in having a look or contributing, I can push the code up. It's sitting about 4k LoC -- compared to ~10k for the existing JS. I think the LoC will end up around 20k, so clearly I'm one quarter done 17:39:54 <06pleasingfungus> ...one fifth... 😛 17:40:25 <06pleasingfungus> i could certainly look, though i have only the slightest frontend experience, so don't know if i'd be much help 17:40:54 clearly one sixth because you always underestimate 🙂 17:41:15 s/you/people/ 17:47:03 <09gammafunk> our players...they wouldn't.....would they...??? 17:49:44 Would it be possible to interact with global chat from dgamelaunch? 18:02:08 <04dracoomega> Is there some specific good reason that 'post-roll to-hit modifiers' are done pre-roll for monsters, but post-roll for players are actually done post-roll like it says? Aside from "That's just how the old (considerably less unified) code ended up doing it"? 18:04:49 <04dracoomega> (Makes a bunch of bonuses and penalties do effectively half as much for monsters, as far as I can see - as well as, I guess, making a few bonuses not ensure some low minimal to-hit) 18:07:56 <05alexjurkiewicz> I'm not planning to think about dgl support at all, sorry 18:13:26 <13qwqwqwqwqwqwqw> I think it's likely just "this is how it has always been done" but also I think it isn't necessarily unreasonable, player accuracy/EV and monster accuracy/EV just aren't comparable 18:14:18 <13qwqwqwqwqwqwqw> like I would just disagree with "do effectively half as much for monsters" for this reason 18:14:47 <04dracoomega> Well, perhaps I should rephrase as "the numerical bonus is effectively half as large (due to when it is rolled)" 18:14:58 <04dracoomega> I am not saying they should be unified for the sake of unifying, to be clear 18:15:22 <04dracoomega> Even if it really reads as weird that post-roll is actually pre-roll half the time 18:15:51 <13qwqwqwqwqwqwqw> yeah, the naming of the method is definitely dubious as is 18:17:41 <04dracoomega> (I was in the process of implementing the changes to monster Vhi's and was like "Does the magnitude of this accuracy bonus make sense with whatever to-hit numbers monsters use?" and was a little surprised when I deep-dived monster accuracy code, which I hadn't done in a long time) 18:21:55 <13qwqwqwqwqwqwqw> (though looking more closely at what is actually currently in post_roll_to_hit_modifiers, the only ones that commonly affect both players and monsters are confusion and invisibility, and invisibility already uses a totally different formula in the two cases...) 18:23:42 <13qwqwqwqwqwqwqw> (and the penalty to monster accuracy when trying to hit an invisible player is a multiplier so doesn't care whether it is applied before or after the roll) 18:26:34 <05icoson> Yeah, the problem with global chat is that it will inevitably need moderation, the solutions in place for per game moderation won’t generalize 18:31:01 <13qwqwqwqwqwqwqw> really if we wanted to simplify things here I think my suggestion would be to make the function be applied post-rolls for both players and monsters, change the confusion penalty to be identical to the invis penalty (but stacking), scale translucent skin penalty to be unchanged (since it only affects monsters anyway), and just leave the halo/umbra code unchanged (which would roughly double their effect for monsters attacking 18:31:01 players, but corona is not exactly a strong monster spell and dith is not exactly a strong god) 18:31:40 <05alexjurkiewicz> one part of "global chat" I wanted was just posting server deaths and perhaps other milestones to all games. Just giving people a sense of everyone else simultaneously playing 18:31:58 <13qwqwqwqwqwqwqw> not sure there's a ton of reason to do all that but it wolud simplify things in the future when we want to add a new effect in there, etc 18:34:05 <04dracoomega> Yeah, that seems to make sense to me 18:34:39 <06pleasingfungus> global announcements sound fine and fun 🙂 esp if they link to morgues, ongoing games, etc 18:34:51 <06pleasingfungus> i know some folks here have said they miss em from IRC - maybe @gammafunk ? 18:35:33 <06pleasingfungus> it's fun to see stuff like "xXxBorisLoverxXx just got the golden rune!", etc 18:49:10 <09gammafunk> I'm not sure I've ever said that as such, but I think various of us old timers and fondly remembered the occasional funny/interesting milestone/logfile entry popping up and how it started a conversation 18:49:31 <09gammafunk> but it was also a big pain to manage the spam from it in general 18:49:55 <09gammafunk> cwz has a system pretty similar to what alex is describing (perhaps alex saw it in action there and was inspired?) 18:49:59 <04dracoomega> And we have so many more players these days, also 18:50:18 <04dracoomega> (Like, I do have a soft spot for some of those old messages, but...) 18:50:19 <09gammafunk> it prints special in-chat-only notifications of significant milestones and any wins, but only for cwz itself 18:50:34 <09gammafunk> which I suppose in alex's system this would likewise be per server 18:50:53 <09gammafunk> since there's no global pool of information that's available in a non-trivial way 18:51:09 <09gammafunk> having it be only from games of the server the player is on does drastically reduce the amount of spam 18:51:32 <09gammafunk> and if it only happens in the player chat area it's probably not bad. this is what I recall from seeing it on cwz when they had a full server 18:51:50 <09gammafunk> but yeah, irc is somewhat different beast due to how that's pulling from every server 18:52:05 <09gammafunk> we had to take pains to filter out all but the most interesting messages 18:52:18 <09gammafunk> and of course plenty of people still had those bots blocked regardless 18:52:57 <09gammafunk> I guess if it's configurable on a per-spectator basis or something? probably just enable/disable 19:11:11 <05alexjurkiewicz> I have set up the ability to chat with yourself anywhere, but these chat changes will involve some Python work also. It will come after everything else 19:17:10 <05alexjurkiewicz> you should see the hackery going into picking CPO's "death of the day" to ensure it's not 75% MiBe in early D 19:17:33 <05alexjurkiewicz> the more brackets your death message has, the more likely it is to get picked 19:28:00 <09gammafunk> we opted for an xl-based approach I think 19:28:10 <09gammafunk> all early game deaths/milestones basically filtered out 19:28:26 <09gammafunk> but again, you have to be pretty aggressive when you're seeing events from every single server 19:29:31 03dolorous02 07[neoyred_and_newbeogh] * 0.32-a0-117-g36602a9404: Move Beogh apostle challenges to the database. 10(2 days ago, 2 files, 7+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/36602a9404d8 19:29:31 03dolorous02 07[neoyred_and_newbeogh] * 0.32-a0-118-g498a8085e7: Add a few more Beogh apostle challenges. 10(2 days ago, 1 file, 5+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/498a8085e753 23:35:22 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.32-a0-132-g2d33c3cfaf (34) 23:56:49 03dolorous02 07[neoyred_and_newbeogh] * 0.32-a0-119-gc43287da8d: Fix more typos. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c43287da8d35 23:58:21 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.32-a0-132-g2d33c3cfaf