00:45:26 <Gretell> Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.32-a0-35-gd9ff480968
01:31:39 <Kelbell-> Fork (bcrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-5140-g5775ae71e1
01:31:39 <Kelbell-> Fork (bcrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-5140-g5775ae71e1
08:32:38 <NotCheibriados> New branch created: pull/3484 (18 commits) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-36-gcfb6b25f6a: Update ability.txt 10(46 minutes ago, 1 file, 10+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/cfb6b25f6a03
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-37-g6f36868403: Update backgrounds.txt 10(39 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6f36868403d3
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-38-g81c7a2920f: Update branches.txt 10(38 minutes ago, 1 file, 10+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/81c7a2920f33
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-39-g487257e30b: Update clouds.txt 10(36 minutes ago, 1 file, 14+ 11-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/487257e30b33
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-40-g5aadabf65d: Update features.txt 10(35 minutes ago, 1 file, 7+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5aadabf65d31
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-41-g1bf5c0d5be: Update gods.txt 10(33 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/1bf5c0d5be74
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-42-g55ee870e19: Update items.txt 10(28 minutes ago, 1 file, 136+ 12-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/55ee870e19ba
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-43-g17df250e42: Update monsters.txt 10(26 minutes ago, 1 file, 74+ 17-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/17df250e42d5
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-44-gc04a5df30c: Update mutations.txt 10(24 minutes ago, 1 file, 28+ 26-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c04a5df30c0d
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-45-g02dac3b140: Update skills.txt 10(22 minutes ago, 1 file, 14+ 26-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/02dac3b140a7
08:32:40 <NotCheibriados> ... and 8 more commits
09:02:12 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> reposting from other server: - @hellmonk suggested a monster that is only damageable from short range. i’m pretty into this; DO was too.
09:02:41 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> DO also suggested a version that’s only damageable from range, which is interesting but i’m a bit less sure about.
09:02:59 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> - discussion of putting pyre arrow on drac scorchers (seems fine)
09:04:40 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> - more chat about rmsl mons (i still think a low-ev rmsl aura monster could work somewhere) and some chat about reflect monsters
09:05:05 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> think innate reflect could maybe work somewhere, but unsure. don’t think donald is particularly problematic
09:05:26 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> @regret-⸸nde※ called both ‘unsatisfying’; unsure why
09:07:01 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> some talk about the invincible-except-in-melee monster being a holy, which seems cool to me. fits my ancient pitch of ‘make holy monsters set rules of engagement’ (rather than being just holy wrath themed)
09:11:29 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> For clarification, what I actually said was having two different monsters (probably in different parts of the game) use the 'can only be hurt while you're near them' mechanic - one of which was themselves a ranged attacker (and another one that was a melee attacker)
09:12:05 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Such that the former essentially wants you to come to them, while the latter merely prevents you from getting early damage while they are on their way to you
09:13:27 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> (Something that can only be hurt while the player isn't close to them is... potentially interesting, but I think a lot more dicey out of the gate, unless it's quite fragile, since many characters don't have good ways of doing damage from a distance)
09:16:39 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> My thoughts about pyre arrow on draconian scorchers is mostly "There's already a fair bit of that in relatively prominent places" and I'm not sure how much more widespread it needs to be. But admittedly, half of games won't get Spider, people might do Elf while the pyromancers aren't a significant risk, and balrugs are more of an extended thing. So maybe I'm wrong there.
09:30:58 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> no strong opinion on scorchers
09:31:08 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> broadly agreed otherwise
09:45:20 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Though when I think about it a little more, I could see the 'can only hurt at range' mechanic being potentially interesting on a unique. That way we can limit it to at-most once per game, and uniques are easier to park and avoid if you really think your character can't deal with them, and the mechanic can be scaled prominant enough to notice, despite this. Some kind of holy archer/caster, perhaps? (Maybe drawing from less Christian
09:45:21 <Discord|> mythos?)
09:46:20 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (rmsl unsatisfaction is mostly that evidently many people with late game range just autofight through spriggan air mages and tengu reavers and suffer through it rather than trying to actually change tactics; reflection unsatisfaction is that donald is a relatively singular encounter compared to something recurring that might be missed inside a group)
09:47:43 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> I'm a little worried about this ghost / mole / beetle / blademaster mostly because of autofight also, though there I did suggest an aura of halo / umbra as a convenient incidental "are you close enough" ui bit so it's much less difficult to miss
09:47:51 <shmup> i like your nick, regret
09:48:01 <shmup> unusual seeing it in irc, but we live in interesting times
09:49:56 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> sojobo somewhat currently serves as the reference point for "near impossible to shoot" unique, even with /roots
09:50:41 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (and happens to spawn in roughly the range where player ranged is strongest)
09:57:08 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> pyre arrow prevalence past the ever-noticeable beetles is weird; pyromancers are mostly noticeable outside of elf, half of the games don't get spider, gehenna is one of the easier hells and balrugs are pretty far down the pan notice point. I suggested pyre arrow for drac scorchers mostly because their spellset is a weird half-joke:
09:57:14 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> *??draconian scorcher
09:57:15 <Discord|> <04C​erebot>  red draconian scorcher (q) | Spd: 10 | HD: 16 | HP: 63-91 | AC/EV: 9/12 | Dam: 15 | weapons, items, doors, evil, spellcaster, cold-blooded | Res: will(40), fire | Corpse | XP: 1214 | Sp: searing breath (3d21) [!AM, !sil, breath], b.fire (3d25), b.magma (3d25), fireball (3d26), hurl damnation (3d20), call down damnation (3d15) | Sz: Medium | Int: human.
09:59:37 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (and as a common sight in zot, having to move to shake it off definitely accomplishes a certain kind of late-game-ranged countering)
10:05:13 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> index: re rmsl aura, my suspicion is that "monster which is easy to shoot but makes all other monsters harder to shoot" will play quite differently from "monster which is hard to shoot".
10:05:42 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> re mole god, if 'are you close enough' is melee range, then it'll be quite easy to tell 🙂
10:06:28 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> the original suggestion was range 2
10:07:23 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> many options
10:07:27 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> could have a whole family of these folks 🙂
10:07:32 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> exploring design space, etc
10:10:18 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Melee range is very simple and intuitive, I agree. (I also think the rmsl aura enemy could be interesting)
10:11:33 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> oh, right, I forgot that the rmsl aura enemy wasn't going to affect itself
10:12:00 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (...hmm. would it be for V? Z? or are we going all in on a third "just die already archers" monster for depths?)
10:12:22 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> these are great questions
10:12:45 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> weakly leaning V
10:13:00 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> mostly because i still think the V enemy set could use more love
10:14:40 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Some kind of repulsion golem, maybe?
10:14:59 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> or yet another ironbound buddy
10:15:00 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> vaguely reminded of brainstorming with draco involving "what if ironbound beastmasters just had an autobuff aura for animals so there's no possible ambiguity on who they support and what that does"
10:15:47 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Kind of like inverse torpor snails. "All beasts in my los are hasted/mighted" or whatever
10:16:03 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> ??glyphs[2]
10:16:04 <Discord|> <04C​erebot> glyphs[2/3]: http://dev.host/~shmup/crawl/dcss-glyphs.html
10:16:57 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> All Beasts In My Sight
10:16:59 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> ...gah, not working here
10:18:00 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> hm, seems a little dead
10:18:08 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> http://s-z.org/neil/tmp/crawl-glyphs-narrow.html is the old one
10:18:18 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> but it's some versions out of date now
10:20:51 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> still have lightcyan and lightmagenta free due to the antcients
10:21:36 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Of what glyph now?
10:22:32 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> on p, the glyph for human people
10:23:29 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (construct 9 technically have magenta and lightmagenta only used by blazeheart and spellforged, but they're both otherwise completely full)
10:25:24 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (which is deeply vexatious since V feels like the place to use more constructs, of course. I guess the thermic / crystal split will also use one of those two...?)
10:25:25 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Huh. ghost_demons can't actually specify willpower
10:25:47 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> ...do player ghost wills not change according to gear and species?
10:26:11 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> That feels a bit weird. Are player ghost special-cased? Surely they don't all have the same will
10:29:22 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Oh, if the mon-data entry has negative willpower, their real willpower is derived from their HD instead
10:29:24 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Apparently
10:33:31 <shmup> crap hey i can put that dev.host page back up, recently changed hosts
10:33:42 <shmup> i need to update 1216 <Discord|> <C​erebot> glyphs[2/3]: http://dev.host/~shmup/crawl/dcss-glyphs.html
10:35:47 <shmup> here's my old one, gonna update it and leave on neocities for now. can someone who is savvy update that learndb entry [2 to https://crawl.neocities.org/
10:39:11 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> done
10:39:21 <shmup> appreciate it
10:41:08 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> an entire subdomain dedicated to crawl glyphs, as it should be!
10:46:27 <shmup> lol
10:46:32 <shmup> i'll move it to xom.world someday
10:46:46 <shmup> it's a mess
10:47:28 <shmup> i wanna rewrite the parser cuz it was a hacked python job and will still be but i'm sure it's missing some colors. i know it is :P
10:49:35 <shmup> https://xom.world/splashes/
11:29:31 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> As I work on sketching out the process of actually defining the properly-randomized apostle stats, I am starting to wonder if ghost_demon is even helpful here. Apparently can't use it to specify willpower (but there's another scaling function for that already), won't be varying speed or natural attack brand/verb, possibly don't need to vary AC/EV since they can be given arbitrarily good armour (admittedly this doesn't affect EV
11:29:31 <Discord|> much, but thematically I don't know that it should), don't need to be a ghost_demon to get arbitrary spells... I think maybe the only thing I'm consistently using it for is base melee damage.
11:29:50 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> (There is some argument that the apostles could use a little behind-the-scenes AC boost at higher levels)
13:34:22 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> i should rework how negative MR works when i do the yamlification...
14:10:52 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> negative.....what?! ....
14:12:38 <Discord|> <09h​ellmonk> negative mr william
14:38:24 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> does halving negative will make it closer to zero
14:55:46 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> definitely
15:25:40 <Discord|> <09h​ellmonk> if positive will and negative will meet the universe will be destroyed
15:27:07 <Discord|> <08w​ormsofcan> negative will should be called grace
15:53:57 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> adding literally all of this to my TODO
15:56:09 <Henzell> frimble (L27 OnEE) ASSERT(entry.second == act->pos()) in 'spl-vortex.cc' at line 429 failed. (Coc:3)
17:40:36 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-54-g06d9d706c5: Update wpnnoise.txt 10(19 seconds ago, 1 file, 4+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/06d9d706c51e
18:09:51 <NotCheibriados> 03Zhang Kai02 {GitHub} 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/3484 * 0.32-a0-55-g72d46368eb: Update wpnnoise.txt 10(61 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/72d46368eba6
21:43:25 <Cbrotell> indexOfRegret (L27 GhIE) Crash caused by signal #6: Aborted (Pan)
21:43:34 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> ...
21:44:10 <Cbrotell> indexOfRegret (L27 GhIE) Crash caused by signal #6: Aborted (Pan)
21:44:24 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> ...well, I sure found a crash on demand.
21:45:11 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> noo
21:45:35 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (I was looking at monster spell icon stuff since it's not on by default in local tiles, decided to look up all mutations with ?/u and .*)
21:47:20 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> hrm
21:47:39 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> is crash upon enter after .*?
21:47:39 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (I'm currently checking to see if any other mutation descriptions are crashing, but:)
21:47:41 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747522859361894521/1199213842429911120/image.png?ex=65c1b9ec&is=65af44ec&hm=7032fcbef976fee159e22f9d824aa2e574bd72aabe7ab9b08b1d6a5bea511a04&
21:47:59 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> whatever, uh, "Potion of" is, it's a free crash
21:48:04 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> ah
21:48:14 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Probably describe_mutation does not like trying to describe... potions(???)
21:48:24 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> is it potions of mutation
21:48:29 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> god
21:48:43 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> !blamedev
21:48:44 <Discord|> <04C​erebot> I pronounce sage... Guilty!
21:48:48 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> lmao
21:48:49 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> Basil....
21:49:36 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> I sure how no idea what it's doing in that list in the first place, whatever it is
21:49:38 <Cbrotell> indexOfRegret (L27 GhIE) Crash caused by signal #6: Aborted (Pan)
21:49:49 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> another crash for `"Daystalker``
21:53:27 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> testing locally now, another crash for "Noise dampening"
21:53:48 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> (working on fixes)
21:54:39 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> yeah if you can push it soonish, we can hit normal rebuild times for most servers and then trigger cko
21:54:53 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> ??rebuild[2
21:54:53 <Discord|> <04C​erebot> rebuild[2/2]: Trunk update start times in UTC (second number during summer time): CAO: 1700; CDO: 0600/0500; CUE: 2300/2200; CXC: 0500/0400; CPO: every 15 minutes; CKO: trunk every 15 minutes, other versions 0830/0730. CDI: trunk and experimentals every 15 minutes, others 0800/0700.
21:54:55 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> !time
21:54:56 <Discord|> <04C​erebot> Time: Jan 23, 2024, 04:54:55 AM, UTC. The 2024 0.31 tournament ends in 12 days, 15 hours, 5 minutes and 4 seconds.
21:55:24 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> can wait for cko actually, guess it's cao that we'd want to trigger in a couple hours
21:55:38 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> oh and cue and possibly cxc, rip
21:55:39 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> (no other descriptions seem to crash)
21:56:19 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> everything other than the potion one is simple to fix
21:57:06 <Discord|> <04d​racoomega> Are these two coincidental-yet-unrelated problems?
21:57:10 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> uh
21:57:14 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> they're related
21:57:16 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> but slightly different
22:02:46 <NotCheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.32-a0-36-g6a59d0303a: Fix ?/u showing potion of (regret-index) 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6a59d0303af2
22:02:46 <NotCheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.32-a0-37-gabbd88f42e: Fix two misnamed mutations (regret-index) 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/abbd88f42ed7
22:02:46 <NotCheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.32-a0-38-gb04dd89b9b: Don't crash on bad mut names (regret-index) 10(51 seconds ago, 1 file, 5+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b04dd89b9bd9
22:02:46 <NotCheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07[stone_soup-0.31] * 0.31.0-5-g6ccc0d935f: Fix ?/u showing potion of (regret-index) 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6ccc0d935f8f
22:02:46 <NotCheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07[stone_soup-0.31] * 0.31.0-6-g63ef89744e: Fix two misnamed mutations (regret-index) 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/63ef89744e35
22:02:46 <NotCheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07[stone_soup-0.31] * 0.31.0-7-gf635a9b802: Don't crash on bad mut names (regret-index) 10(52 seconds ago, 1 file, 5+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f635a9b802ce
22:02:46 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> hack alert :yogidaFeels:
22:02:58 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> the real fix would be to put item descriptions in a separate DB, or to give them a suffix - "potion of mutation item"
22:03:22 <Discord|> <06p​leasingfungus> former seems easier tbh
22:07:27 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> curious question: does https://github.com/crawl/crawl/tree/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/mutations.txt#L123 or https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/mutations.txt#L481 display when you look up that mutation?
22:21:09 <Discord|> <06r​egret-⸸nde※> latter, apparently