00:30:51 Unstable branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.29-a0-233-g1125b37a9b (34) 01:35:49 Fork (bcrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-4567-gb362bb5a12 01:52:34 Fork (bcadrencrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.03-749-gbd7123f023 02:08:50 Fork (stoatsoup) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.22-s0-49-g49afeaee9e 04:23:05 Experimental (bcrawl) branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-4567-gb362bb5a12 05:09:53 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.29-a0-233-g1125b37 (34) 05:45:43 Is it intended that Sniper's description says "This weapons minimum attack delay (1.3) is reached at skill level 28."? 05:49:41 Yes. 05:50:09 There's been some discussion of how to convey "you can't actually get there", but it's not an unexamined wording. 06:03:00 Cool 06:08:30 Okay, I think I'm confused with how AUTs work—the intention of "you.props[USKAYAW_AUDIENCE_TIMER] = 300 + random2(201);" is to set a delay before prepare audience can trigger again in the range of 400±100 auts, right? 06:12:00 But from testing by giving myself max Usk piety, whacking a training dummy at an attack delay of 1.0 (which I think is 10 auts?), I can get prepare audience to trigger in this space of time: 06:12:00 Uskayaw prepares the audience for your solo! / Hit / Para ends / Hit*3 / Uskayaw prepares the audience for your solo! 06:12:11 During this whole period I'm at ***** period and zero invo 06:15:01 Note that other times the times between the two "Uskayaw prepares [...]" can be more like 25 hits in a row 06:18:42 While I'm not really sure what was intended, but I feel like going from a range between 4 to over 25 hits between prepare audience triggers seems pretty large 06:36:05 Are you hitting piety breakpoints in the upper end of that range? 06:38:59 No, there's no god messages at all during the first 4 hit sequence and just one in the > 25 hit one about pain bond ending 06:45:43 <05kate> it's just a sort of misleadingly named prop, it's not actually a timer 06:45:43 <05kate> !source player-reacts.cc:408 06:45:43 <04Cerebot> https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/player-reacts.cc#L408 06:45:43 * perryprog facepalm 06:45:43 don't know how I missed that, thanks 06:45:54 (This isn't the first time I've been confused and looked at prepare audience's implementation to see why that sometimes happens, either) 06:46:41 <05kate> the comment there is sort of wrong too and implies it's an actual timer though, so it's easy to get confused 06:47:45 <05kate> i assume it's working as intended and the comment got added later without quite understanding how it works, but i'd be curious to see if the comment was added at the same time as the implementation 06:48:57 looks like it https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/00f313466480bc9ac929c42b3a80fadd65959154 06:49:23 which was then changed in https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5e2051132192bce66ed5d305ef0ac151fe1fb8dd 06:52:22 <05kate> interesting, i wonder if it was intended to be an actual timer in the first place then 06:52:49 <12ebering> I have a vague memory of it being randomized at some point over the experimental/iteration phase of usk so that you wouldn’t be encouraged to count trigger intervals 06:52:51 it'd make sense if it was supposed to be considering the first TIMER = 300 + random2(201). It seems weird that that then'd be combined into the y of with an x_in_y 06:53:06 Right, that seems bad 06:53:23 <05kate> i think the actual current behaviour is fine either way probably, yeah 06:53:34 <05kate> so maybe just worth clarifying those comments 06:59:09 👍 07:57:35 PleasingFungus: does the accuracy from slaying matter for big weapons, maybe? they tend to have low accuracy 08:00:03 <10PleasingFungus> i believe not really once you're at mindelay, which is what i was looking at 08:00:03 <10PleasingFungus> could fiddle and see if that's true 10:02:14 <10PleasingFungus> think i'm happy with the new damage rates display after tinkering with it for quite a while; will probably push it soon if no one sees obvious issues or bugs 10:02:14 <10PleasingFungus> currently looks like this 10:02:14 <10PleasingFungus> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747522859361894521/948263761997856848/unknown.png 10:02:14 <10PleasingFungus> overrates quick blades but that's fine 10:07:23 03PleasingFungus02 07[damage-rates] * 0.29-a0-234-g8612436: Rate my damage (WIP) 10(11 hours ago, 8 files, 200+ 70-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/86124364fd4f 10:09:04 <10PleasingFungus> i wanted to keep the brand stuff closer to the damage rates so it was easier to add up nicely, but didn't want to fully integrate it because of stuff like holy wrath 10:09:30 <12ebering> guess I could sit down and read it, but concerned that the difference between multiplicative and additive brands gets obscured 10:09:35 <12ebering> (maybe it doesn't matter???) 10:09:48 <12ebering> (but I feel like it does in terms of making informed strategic decisions maybe?) 10:10:18 maybe mention that the damage is reduced by enemy AC? 10:11:03 <10PleasingFungus> spicycebolla: mention where? to what? 10:11:29 in that damage rating display? like as a reminder 10:11:44 <12ebering> this is going to appear in weapon descriptions 10:11:48 "each hit with this weapon is reduced by the target's AC" to help with the overrating of quick blades 10:12:25 <10PleasingFungus> that's an enormous amount of text to stick in, and also it seems sort of obvious tbh? 10:12:58 <10PleasingFungus> my feeling is that (a) calling it a "rating" instead of an "average" maybe helps and (b) showing per-hit damage there (in addition to the "rating" over time) maybe also helps 10:13:00 sure, just tryna think of what might help make QB not look too good 10:13:17 <12ebering> I think that we can require the player to think 10:13:17 <10PleasingFungus> that's fair! we can revisit this if it turns into a problem in practice 10:13:41 <10PleasingFungus> ebering: i did some earlier drafts that break down weapon brand damage more, but it's all a bit fiddly 10:15:50 <10PleasingFungus> want to try this version at least as a first draft 10:15:50 <10PleasingFungus> can always make things more complex later 10:15:50 <12ebering> I was suggesting less complex: leave out the brand for now 10:15:50 <10PleasingFungus> hrm, undecided 10:15:50 <10PleasingFungus> feels nice to have on hand for weapon comparisons, so you can have a better idea of how that -1 hand axe of flaming compares to the +0 flail or w/e 10:15:50 <10PleasingFungus> of course, even this version doesn't try with a few brands, spectral and venom 10:15:50 oh yeah, i often wonder when to stop using the -1 flame weapon 10:16:01 tho ofc it doesn't super matter, you can just wait til something good appears 10:16:07 <10PleasingFungus> but not showing brands would still end up factoring in speed brand specifically, which is a lil funny 10:17:02 i've noticed monster EV and AC seem to generally go up more as the game goes on, but like, for on a monster with a bias towards one or the other, the gap between AC and EV can be higher. so in lair you can fsim a definite best weapon 10:17:23 but in zot5 when an enemy might have between 5 and 20 AC, doublesword will be better on the 20 AC one, and dblade will be better on the 5 AC one 10:36:18 <12ebering> yes 10:36:19 <10PleasingFungus> i do feel like, if we don't show brand info, players will ask for it 10:36:27 <10PleasingFungus> exciting question is whether the info i'm currently showing is better than nothing 10:36:32 <12ebering> thinking about how to show it in the brand line 10:36:45 <12ebering> (also not sure about it factoring in delay vs. just showing the player's current delay) 10:37:14 <10PleasingFungus> feels sort of nice to have it do the math there, even if the math is sort of misleading 10:37:36 <12ebering> misleading math is exactly what I'm concerned about!! 10:37:43 <10PleasingFungus> fair 12:11:51 i been rethinkin mindarmor - what if instead of giving Will+, it gave you a bit of a Will-related puzzle to solve? like each time an enemy checks Will, the player gets 5 AC 12:11:51 or if the player succeeds on Will check, they get the Tomb card effect. an item that incentivizes raising will but doesn't directly help with that 12:12:29 well, one wouldn't want the tomb effect randomly, but some better incentive 12:12:36 <12ebering> tomb effect is definitely something we don't want to be passing out outside of nemelex 12:17:06 03DreamDust02 {ebering} 07* 0.29-a0-234-g0dae59b: Seven new vaults 10(5 months ago, 3 files, 207+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0dae59b3db99 12:23:07 Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.29-a0-234-g0dae59b3db (34) 12:39:19 <10PleasingFungus> rip the spell 12:40:08 <10PleasingFungus> idea: potion of cowardice. double move speed for ~15 turns, but you can't attack, cast or use abilities for the duration. (then give one to Hunter start) 12:40:50 <10PleasingFungus> alternate version gives 10 Horr (as sac courage) instead (-slay and spelpow), but that seems less scary in terms of locking out other escape/survival options 12:40:53 <12ebering> Wdyt about vuln for AM 12:40:58 <10PleasingFungus> oh, sort of into that 12:41:01 <10PleasingFungus> i did like immo tho 12:41:04 <10PleasingFungus> hm 12:41:05 <10PleasingFungus> ??am 12:41:06 <04Cerebot> arcane marksman[1/2]: A {warrior-mage} background (abbreviated as AM) that starts with a ranged weapon (bow, crossbow, sling, throwing) and ammo, the spells {Corona}, {Slow}, {Inner Flame}, {Portal Projectile}, and {Cause Fear}, a +0 robe, and skill for their ranged weapon and Hexes. 12:41:12 <12ebering> immo v funny 12:41:23 <10PleasingFungus> it's like the invis for en; preview of a later effect 12:41:35 <10PleasingFungus> hm, vuln is interesting though 12:41:36 <12ebering> True 12:41:45 <10PleasingFungus> could do immo for hu and vuln for am 12:42:12 <12ebering> (Still think 2 pots for fi/en is 2 generous) 12:42:39 <12ebering> Big Australian Aboriginal fire hunter vibes in giving hu immo 12:42:40 <12ebering> Into it 12:42:47 <10PleasingFungus> oh, hadn't even thought of that angle 12:46:08 potion of cowardice sounds pretty powerful IMO 12:46:08 double move speed is a bit ridiculous 12:46:08 <10PleasingFungus> it's mostly worse ?blink 12:46:08 <10PleasingFungus> for better or worse 12:46:08 <12ebering> worse imo 12:46:13 <10PleasingFungus> probably 12:46:17 Apropos not much, I wonder what randart potions would be like 12:46:36 <10PleasingFungus> gozag potion petition 12:46:43 While I doubt there's no good reason to ever implement artifact consumables... definitely some interesting things that could be done 12:46:46 <12ebering> Also a worse haste in a sense 12:46:47 <10PleasingFungus> i just really like the idea of quaffing this potion while looking for unid'd things and while surrounded by enemies 12:46:49 I thought potion petition was standard potions? 12:46:51 <12ebering> Better for running away but one dimensional 12:46:54 <10PleasingFungus> yes 12:47:10 <10PleasingFungus> potion petition is a bunch of different potions mixed together, like a randart mixes together different props 12:47:16 oh neat, didn't know that 12:47:16 a randart ring is just a bunch of regular rings, same as potion petition 12:47:40 you gonna lock Fo out of cowardice? 12:47:46 Oh for sure 12:47:56 <10PleasingFungus> no, but it would count as hasty for chei 12:48:05 (I guess you could say Fo gets the shaft on a lot of consumables) 12:48:17 Oh. I figured it'd be treated the same as !haste. 12:48:37 <10PleasingFungus> it'd be you flailing your legs really fast like a looney toons 12:48:40 <10PleasingFungus> you know 12:48:47 meep meep 12:49:21 itemdesc "meep meep" -Road RUnner, Looney Tunes, 1936 12:49:57 <10PleasingFungus> indeed 12:50:15 Maybe a potion that absorbs N physical attacks but ends early if you attack 12:52:58 (� la D&D's Mirror Image) 12:52:58 <10PleasingFungus> very heal wounds-y 12:53:01 eh, true. Also pretty one dimensional in that it's a last-chance emergency item 12:54:54 <10PleasingFungus> don't think i'd say that 12:54:58 <10PleasingFungus> lots of cases where you'd pre-quaff it 12:55:10 <10PleasingFungus> going into the orb chamber or tomb:3 would be reasonable 12:55:24 Would give some interesting ways of dealing with ogres if you're playing Fi instead of Gl for whatever crazy reason 12:55:47 I do like the ideal of transmutation based potions, mainly because I think transmutation spell flavor is super cool 12:56:56 I suppose there's probably plenty of offensive potions already but something that transmutes you into statute form or similar that gives you massive AC and GDR but a super slow movement speed sounds neat 12:57:41 Or maybe one that transmutes you into a random form with like a 1/4 chance for a bad form (although honestly, bad forms are usually not actually "bad" because of their speed bonuses) 12:59:46 Also I am a fan of super rare consumables that give you hard decisions to make on when to use them. I've always found grappling with the "I might need it later" instinct to be fun to think through as a player. 12:59:46 (Hence my thought on unrandart potions which would be that turned up to an even greater degree) 13:00:24 <10PleasingFungus> a fine goal 13:01:08 was there ever a time shillelagh worked with manifold? i need that build immediately 13:06:39 <12ebering> No 13:06:45 <12ebering> Sorry 13:13:24 scepter is out as well, am i going to be disappointed if i get dark maul? 13:15:06 <12ebering> It’s only a handful of aoe ones 13:15:23 yeah i imagine arcblade doesnt work 13:15:30 firestarter? 13:15:35 that would be unreal 13:20:08 <12ebering> Fire starter works. 13:20:08 <12ebering> The ones that don’t work are the ones that would prompt you about harming an ally 13:29:17 <05kate> i don't think having more slightly different kinds of stacking haste would be great (haste itself, swift, cowardice), but some kind of upside in return for locking you out of other actions is a fun space to play in i think 13:29:25 <05kate> variations on lignification, berserk etc 13:31:11 do potion of manafeet. you can move instantly but it costs 3 mana until youre out, then you're F'd 13:33:51 <10PleasingFungus> don't sound very F'd 13:33:51 <10PleasingFungus> sounds like better blink again, mostly 13:33:51 <10PleasingFungus> with worse ui and trickier code 13:33:51 no not F'd for real you're just stuck 13:33:51 its Fo friendly! 13:33:51 <10PleasingFungus> 🙂 13:33:51 manafeet + dig...... 13:36:08 I wonder if there's any room for caster based tradeoffs like half mana cost but more damage taken similar to harm 14:35:46 -!- kate-- is now known as kate- 15:04:47 -!- kate-- is now known as kate- 16:17:30 03Ivy Sly02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2456 * 0.29-a0-234-g9217e76: removed unused #define 10(47 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9217e765fdca 16:17:30 03Ivy Sly02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2456 * 0.29-a0-235-g11cb150: fixed orblets cancelling each other out when rapidly fired 10(26 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/11cb1501fec2 16:17:30 03Ivy Sly02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2456 * 0.29-a0-236-gcf34ec4: orblets shouldn't make noise on hit 10(25 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/cf34ec413451 16:24:23 03Ivy Sly02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2456 * 0.29-a0-237-g503009a: remove seeinv on sorcerer's shortbow 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/503009a51581 16:25:01 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.29-a0-234-g0dae59b3db (34) 17:06:44 <05kate> https://forgottenarbiter.github.io/Is-Every-Seed-Winnable/ got linked this in another discord and found it a fun read on the topic of winnability in slay the spire, in the context of crawl's philosophy section on unwinnable games 17:07:38 <05kate> and this follow-up of actually finding an unwinnable seed: https://oohbleh.github.io/losing-seed/, sadly i guess you probably can't construct an unwinnable scenario in crawl to test for as neatly but it's a fun thought experiment 17:09:21 <10PleasingFungus> oh, i remember seeing that first article! very cool 17:09:52 <10PleasingFungus> fun to see someone finally taking the age old question of "how often do you end up with an 'unfair' 'unwinnable' seed" and really run with it 17:10:29 <10PleasingFungus> reading the follow up now 17:11:04 <05kate> exactly yeah, super interesting to see what that actually results in when you really try to prove it 17:12:55 who won that DD^zin? 17:12:55 you can win anything i guess 17:12:55 <10PleasingFungus> !lg * dd zin won 17:12:55 <04Cerebot> 16. EnegeticOcto the Metallomancer (L19 DDEE of Zin), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2020-05-29 09:35:37, with 1531077 points after 58402 turns and 4:47:29. 17:12:55 <10PleasingFungus> hm 17:12:59 <10PleasingFungus> !lm * god.worship=zin dd won s=gid 17:13:01 <04Cerebot> 56 milestones for * (god.worship=zin dd won): 2x Xqgold:cko:20210320184334S, yom:cwz:20170602130311S, BaNaNa:cszo:20140513002733S, billz999:cbr2:20201117033845S, boshi:cwz:20180224140038S, damdam:lld:20140911145123S, DarkwingDuck:cbro:20180417145027S, DEFE:cxc:20161014055325S, DEFE:cxc:20180724073112S, Deprived:cszo:20140521172305S, DreamDust:cko:20210705031015S, dynast:cjr:20180721014004S, Enege... 17:13:14 it wasnt a late game conversion 17:13:18 <10PleasingFungus> that's probably not the query i want, i want to confirm it's the first god followed that game 17:13:19 <10PleasingFungus> yeah 17:19:46 PF can you spec me on CAO for a sec? i have no mana regen for some reason 17:19:46 <10PleasingFungus> ok 17:19:46 <10PleasingFungus> guardian spirit amulet 17:19:46 <10PleasingFungus> take that off 17:19:57 what happened? 17:19:57 <10PleasingFungus> happy to help 17:20:07 <10PleasingFungus> dd doesn't regen mp while wearing guardian spirit 17:20:30 gross 17:20:40 <10PleasingFungus> should probably mark it useless tbh 17:20:53 <10PleasingFungus> it's not technically useless but it's very close 17:21:31 <05kate> it does give you a message when you put it on, it definitely shouldn't be marked useless 17:21:59 <10PleasingFungus> i know about the equip message 🙂 17:22:43 <10PleasingFungus> hm, maybe it’s good with ru actually 17:22:56 <09hellmonk> remove dd for 0.29 17:22:58 <09hellmonk> thx 17:23:39 <10PleasingFungus> (it’s tech with ambrosia/!magic but not that exciting tech) 17:24:02 <10PleasingFungus> imagining a dd^sif with guardian spirit 17:24:13 <10PleasingFungus> the worst pseudo heals 17:24:16 is the effect too powerful to share with damage shaving? 17:24:45 and will it still be disabled with jiyva? 17:26:32 <10PleasingFungus> it’s out of combat regen, which dd aren’t supposed to have from items 17:26:32 <10PleasingFungus> j would make it work, i think? unsure 17:26:32 small chance ill have that answer in a moment 17:26:32 <10PleasingFungus> praying 5 u 17:26:32 paying 5 or praying 4? 17:26:37 ill give you my cashapp 17:33:23 <10PleasingFungus> btw, right now, damage-rates i think reports as its "damage rating" about twice the damage you'd expect to do pre-ac 17:33:23 <10PleasingFungus> since we don't halve after applying stats, but attack.cc does random2 after applying stats 17:33:23 <10PleasingFungus> not sure if that matters! 17:33:23 <10PleasingFungus> maybe it's fine to report a bigger number. it's fun 17:36:17 <10PleasingFungus> nothing else i really want to do on the branch at this point. vaguely thinking about landing it this coming weekend. but no rush 17:37:38 I haven't looked at the implementation so this might be difficult, but it wouldn't hurt to add some unit tests to make sure it doesn't go out of whack in the future for some reason 17:38:28 03PleasingFungus02 07[a-good-start] * 0.29-a0-229-g19db1d7: New Hu/AM starting items (ebering) 10(3 minutes ago, 3 files, 6+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/19db1d723540 17:39:37 Branch pull/2435 updated to be equal with a-good-start: 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2435 17:40:14 (or do we just have integration tests?_ 17:40:14 )* 17:47:09 <09hellmonk> am about to die trying to vuln slow sigmund 17:50:41 <10PleasingFungus> woot 19:11:08 -!- robin_ is now known as robin 21:30:55 New branch created: pull/2458 (2 commits) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2458 21:30:55 03RojjaCebolla02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2458 * 0.29-a0-235-g4799b09: Add an arrival vault with teleporters 10(29 minutes ago, 1 file, 37+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4799b091f1ce 21:30:55 03RojjaCebolla02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2458 * 0.29-a0-236-ge8b410d: Update old "teleporter" vault to use transporters 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 25+ 19-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e8b410d267a9 21:47:48 <10PleasingFungus> wow, fast 21:48:11 <10PleasingFungus> @hellmonk don't forget monspeak 21:48:27 <09hellmonk> ya, couldnt think of any good lines 21:48:32 <10PleasingFungus> this is my life 21:48:34 <10PleasingFungus> maybe i'll add some 21:49:59 <09hellmonk> I'll go ahead and pr it ig 21:50:18 New branch created: punished_grum (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/tree/punished_grum 21:50:18 03hellmonk02 07[punished_grum] * 0.29-a0-235-g48f275f: feat: Grunn the Punished 10(22 minutes ago, 11 files, 48+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/48f275f97aa7 21:51:17 New branch created: pull/2459 (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2459 21:51:17 Branch pull/2459 updated to be equal with punished_grum: 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2459 21:51:54 <09hellmonk> feel free to add at you're leisure 21:51:54 <10PleasingFungus> tyty 21:51:54 <10PleasingFungus> 0.29 version of unique 22:05:00 03RojjaCebolla02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/2458 * 0.29-a0-236-g31478f3: Update old "teleporter" vault to use transporters 10(41 minutes ago, 1 file, 35+ 28-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/31478f3867a6 23:34:48 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.29-a0-234-g0dae59b3db (34) 23:53:47 In trunk when your MP is restored it says "HP restored." 23:55:03 <12ebering> are you sure you weren't also recovering HP? 23:55:06 <12ebering> because I can't replicate 23:56:27 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.29-a0-234-g0dae59b3db 23:56:42 I was also recovering HP but it wasn't finished recovering. 23:56:46 I'll take a screenshot next time 23:57:32 <12ebering> nope, still doesn't replicate